Is this a miracle of God?

_STEVE7150
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Is this a miracle of God?

Post by _STEVE7150 » Sat Jan 07, 2006 4:13 pm

According to 2nd Kings, Manasseh had all the Torah scrolls systematically destroyed over the course of his reign around 700BC. He practiced idolatry and jewish tradition says he had the prophet Isaiah sawed in half.
Manasseh's son Amon then became king for two years and continued idolatry. He was murdered and his son Josiah became king at the age of 8. It had been over 50 years without the Torah when:
"Then Hilkiah the high priest said to Shaphan the scribe, "I have found the book of the law in the House of the Lord." 2Kings 22.8
After 50 years of no Torah it suddenly appears in the Temple for the high priest to find. How do they know this is really an authentic Torah? They bring it to a WOMEN a prophetess to discern from God.
"So Hilkiah the high priest ,Ahikam,Achbor,Shaphan and Asaiah went to HULDAH the prophetess the wife of Shallum and they spoke to her." She said to them ,Thus says the Lord." 2Kings 22.15-16
Huldah a women validated the authenticity of the Torah and King Josiah repented himself and eliminated the idolatress practices of Judah and reinstated Torah law.
Was this a miracle that the one and only Torah in Judea was found? Was a women validating it a type symbolically representing the Mary's being the first to validate the resurrection of Christ?
According to my notes in my Tanach (Stone edition) "Manasseh had systematically destroyed all the Torah scrolls."
Miracle or coincedence?
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_STEVE7150
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Post by _STEVE7150 » Fri Jan 13, 2006 11:36 pm

Hey, Does'nt anyone see this as a miracle? All the Torah scrolls except one which just appears in the temple after Manasseh ordered every single one destroyed? Do you think God divinely protected it?
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_Sean
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Post by _Sean » Sat Jan 14, 2006 4:49 am

Very nice insight, I've never thought about it that way before. And yes, I think God did proctect it.
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_Christopher
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Post by _Christopher » Sat Jan 14, 2006 10:36 am

It never ceases to amaze me how God has protected His written Word through millenia of wars, persecutions, intellectual attacks, etc. Kings and kingdoms have come and gone, but the Word remains untouched. How can anyone see that as anything but a miracle?
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"If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free." John 8:31-32

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_Paidion
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Post by _Paidion » Sat Jan 14, 2006 11:44 am

I know I'm starting to wander off topic, but WHICH "written word" did He protect and "preserve untouched"? Both the "Protestant Bible" (66 books) and the "Catholic Bible" (including the Apocrypha) have been preserved.

I doubt whether either one is "untouched". I John 5:7 as it appears in the King James Version is clearly an addition. The story of the stoning of the adulteress have appeared in many different places over the years, and almost certaintly was not a part of John's gospel where it appears in our bibles.

This is just two examples of many. The "written word" is supposed to be infallible in the original manuscripts. But no one possesses the original manuscripts. When they were in existence the "canon of the New Testament" had not yet been defined. When the "canon" was defined, the original manuscripts did not exist. So, at no time in history did the "infallible New Testament" actually exist!

That doesn't sound too much like "being preserved and untouched."
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_Christopher
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Post by _Christopher » Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:12 pm

Hi Paidion,

Perhaps "untouched" is not the right word. I was using hyperbole there. I don't deny that errors have crept in through copies over the years. However, from what I understand, the NT as we have it today is about 98% pure and the OT is about 95. And the differences that do exist between the manuscripts do not challenge any essential Christian doctrines. That is quite remarkable IMO, given the age of the writings and the deliberate attempts over the years to eliminate them. As I understand it, no other ancient writings can come close to making that claim.

I'm betting you have researched this much more than I have. But I stand pretty confident that God has miraculously preserved for us the things He wants us to know in His written word.

Lord bless.
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_livingink
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Miracle?

Post by _livingink » Sat Jan 14, 2006 1:53 pm

In looking through the KJV and NIV I am having difficulty finding where it says the writings were destroyed. Manasseh was an idolator and "destroyed" the word of God for a time by neglecting and rejecting them through evil practices. God got his attention through the Assyrian army and captivity. Manasseh repented re: 2 Chronicles 33:12. In fact, he apparently restored worship of God v.15-17.

You make an interesting comment re: Huldah. Maybe one of you can clarify her role. To an extent, my dictionary says that the term prophet has encompassed more than one definition in history. For example, they make the point that Samuel appears to have instituted schools for promising students that would then fill the office of prophet. The student would have been able to have taken a part of scripture and interpreted it. On the other hand, we have the idea that prophets get the message directly from God and don't necessarily need a section of scripture to read and then interpret. (Oral and written word of God?) I also understand that the Spirit of the Lord would be on the prophet whether written or oral communication is contemplated(1Samuel 10:6) . In what light would we see Huldah?
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_STEVE7150
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Post by _STEVE7150 » Sat Jan 14, 2006 2:38 pm

In looking through the KJV and NIV I am having difficulty finding where it says the writings were destroyed. Manasseh was an idolator and "destroyed" the word of God for a time by neglecting and rejecting them through evil practices. God got his attention through the Assyrian army and captivity. Manasseh repented re: 2 Chronicles 33:12. In fact, he apparently restored worship of God v.15-17.

You make an interesting comment re: Huldah. Maybe one of you can clarify her role. To an extent, my dictionary says that the term prophet has encompassed more than one definition in history. For example, they make the point that Samuel appears to have instituted schools for promising students that would then fill the office of prophet. The student would have been able to have taken a part of scripture and interpreted it. On the other hand, we have the idea that prophets get the message directly from God and don't necessarily need a section of scripture to read and then interpret. (Oral and written word of God?) I also understand that the Spirit of the Lord would be on the prophet whether written or oral communication is contemplated(1Samuel 10:6) . In what light would we see Huldah?


The info that all the Torah scrolls were destroyed was in the notes of my Tanach(OT) by Irving Stone which orthodox jews use and probably came from jewish historical records.
As fas as i know Huldah isn't mentioned anyplace else and i would guess that in this case the Spirit of the Lord was upon her.
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_chriscarani
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Post by _chriscarani » Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:24 pm

Interesting topic Steve. Its good to be back, hope you holidays were pleasant.
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_STEVE7150
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Post by _STEVE7150 » Sun Jan 15, 2006 11:55 pm

Hi Chris, I don't know where you went but i'm glad you're back.
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