Do babies go to hell if they die?

[Guest]

I wouldn't think so, Paidion, because wouldn't it need a womb to protect and nurture it?

That is naturally what we would think, because of our experience in this life. But perhaps in the resurrection it will be protected and nurtured directly by God.

[Guest]

Well, yes, Steve7150; I fully agree.

But your statements do not address my question. Suppose a foetus dies in say the first month, or a zygote dies (just the united egg and sperm).
What will it look like when it is resurrected?

In the case of a zygote, will it still be a zygote in the resurrection, and just carry on from there in its growth?

By that logic, if a Christian dies by fire, they will be resurrected as charred and burned. In other words, they will resemble the latest stage they were in before death.

I think we will be given a resurrection body that is perfect, in a perfect state of development. Remember, we grow as infants to a state of maturity and then decline after that until death because of the curse. A resurrection body will be a mature one, not one that still needs to mature more.

[Guest]

By that logic, if a Christian dies by fire, they will be resurrected as charred and burned. In other words, they will resemble the latest stage they were in before death.

I think we will be given a resurrection body that is perfect, in a perfect state of development. Remember, we grow as infants to a state of maturity and then decline after that until death because of the curse. A resurrection body will be a mature one, not one that still needs to mature more.

Many times I have heard people say that everyone will have an apparent
age of about 30 (supposedly the ideal age). Yet somehow ---- and I admit this may be mere human reasoning --- it seems ludicrous that a single-celled zygote, the union of a sperm and egg, would be resurrected as a 30-year old, with absolutely no experience in living.

[Guest]

Many times I have heard people say that everyone will have an apparent
age of about 30 (supposedly the ideal age). Yet somehow ---- and I admit this may be mere human reasoning --- it seems ludicrous that a single-celled zygote, the union of a sperm and egg, would be resurrected as a 30-year old, with absolutely no experience in living.

Hmm. Well, God created Adam as a fully mature man with no experience in living.

[Guest]

Good point, Michelle.

There is, of course, the following difference (and perhaps this is not necessary for me to point out, as you are fully aware of it):

We are discussing the resurrection of the zygote.

Your reference is to the creation of Adam.

[Guest]

Good point, Michelle.

There is, of course, the following difference (and perhaps this is not necessary for me to point out, as you are fully aware of it):

We are discussing the resurrection of the zygote.

Your reference is to the creation of Adam.

True, but like I pointed out. The "zygote" isn't going to be raised as a zygote. It's going to be raised in a glorified state, in the image of Christ, not the image of a zygote.

No matter how small, a unique human being with unique DNA is a unique person.

I mean, will someone born retarted and deformed be resurrected retarted and deformed? Again, I believe we will be like Jesus in the resurrection, not like "us".

[Guest]

Sean - I agree with you - everyone will be resurrected in perfection, but, as a mother, I think it would be amazing to watch a child grow up without the dangers and temptations that are present in this world. Just a thought.

My grandparents, back in the 1930's, had two babies that died after only living a few weeks. They looked forward to seeing them in heaven, even 60 or more years later when they reached the end of their lives on earth. I had a miscarriage when I was only a couple of months pregnant - as have a number of women I know. The thing they tell you, I guess to make you feel better (?), is that the baby wasn't viable. I think I bought into that thinking - that it was all a mistake. I never considered that I might see that child. This thread has made me hopeful that maybe I'll see another child of mine someday.

[Guest]

I mean, will someone born retarted and deformed be resurrected retarted and deformed? Again, I believe we will be like Jesus in the resurrection, not like "us".

I understand you, Sean.

Yet I see a difference in being born retarded or deformed, or blind, with hands attached to the shoulders.

All of these are aberrations of what we were meant to be. So of course, these defects will not be present in the resurrection of these people. Likewise, if we were born normal, but went blind later, or lost an arm, or became senile, we would not expect to be resurrected with these defects.
I suppose the resurrection of Jesus, with the nail prints in his hands, and the spear thrust in his side, was an exception, as an everlasting reminder of what He did in suffering and dying on our behalf.

But being a zygote, or a pre-born child, or a born child of 8 months old, is not a defect. They are a natural part of the development of the child, just what the child was meant to be. Just like being born with two arms, two legs, and a head, is natural, and God's intention for us.

So I would conclude that we could expect to have two arms, two legs, and a head in the resurrection. And just possibly, if we were a zygote, a foetus, or an 8-month-old child at the time of death, we might be resurrected at that age and allowed to grow to maturity.

Someone could argue that if this were the case, then to be consistent a 95 year old person would be resurrected at an apparent age of 95. I am not at all certain whether or not this would be a logical deduction. But if they were, they might not look 95, but may appear to be ageless.

When John saw Jesus in his vision on the island of Patmos, he did not see a robust young man of 30. This is what he saw:

Rev 1:12-18 Then I turned to see the voice that was speaking to me, and on turning I saw seven golden lampstands, and in the midst of the lampstands one like a son of man, clothed with a long robe and with a golden girdle round his breast; his head and his hair were white as white wool, white as snow; his eyes were like a flame of fire, his feet were like burnished bronze, refined as in a furnace, and his voice was like the sound of many waters ... and his face was like the sun shining in full strength. When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. But he laid his right hand upon me, saying, "Fear not, I am the first and the last, and the living one; I died, and behold I am alive for evermore, and I have the keys of Death and Hades.

[Guest]

"He mourned for several days and then when his servants asked him why he seemed to nonchalantly wash and eat after mourning in sackcloth for many days he gives the passage in 2nd Samuel 12:22 - 23. He's going to him which appears to indicate that this child will be reunited with his father after death."

Or, death is the end of the line one way or the other, the child then would go where he goes. Many interpret the passage to state that David expected to be reunited with his son after death. The translations that I read give me the impression that David was saying that the child would no longer speak to him as the child was dead. There's considerable weight in scripture to suggest that Bathsheba's child would not have truly been David's son anyway, since he was conceived while Bathsheba was bound to Uriah, and would have been, as the issue of the "one flesh" partner of Uriah, Uriah's son.

In any case no answer is provided in scripture about the destination of the stillborn or of dead infants. We only know they are chosen for one fate or another as all of us are before the foundations of the world. John the Baptist for instance, lept in his mother's womb upon the arrival of Mary. John was already God's servant. We know that Judas was a "Son of Perdition" also suggesting he was consigned to hell from the beginning. The danger in the temptation to declare all infants in the arms of God is that of Andrea Yates, who killed her children while they were still "innocent" to save them while they were "still innocent". By acting all soft and fuzzy on this issue, we also make abortion Doctors the world's greatest evangelists as they consign millions to heaven by killing them while they are yet young.

Hugh McBryde

[Guest]

Judas being called "son of predition" means he was elected to hell from the beginning? Really , well then Peter must be headed there too since Jesus called him Satan. "Get thee behind me Satan." I still have not seen a single legitimate verse that seals a persons eternal destiny to events that must take place in this lifetime only.