The Forceful Kingdom. Support for the reconciliation of all?

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The Forceful Kingdom. Support for the reconciliation of all?

Post by _Paidion » Wed Feb 06, 2008 11:56 am

The words of our Lord [Luke 16:16]:

The Law and the Prophets were until John; since then the good news of the kingdom of God is preached, and everyone forces his way into it. ESV

The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached, and everyone is forcing his way into it. NIV


Is everyone forcing his way into the kingdom? This statement just does not seem to correspond to reality. The translators of these versions apparently assume that the Greek word "biazetai", a verb that is in the passive form, to be a "middle", that is, a word in passive form which is active in meaning. But why not assume the passive voice? What happens to the translation if one does so?

The law and the prophets were until John. Since then, the Gospel of the Kingdom of God is being proclaimed and everyone is forced into it.

In our present day, if we are forced into something, it is assumed to be against our will. But this is not necessarily so. If X wants Y to choose G, he can arrange cirumstances so that Y is more likely to choose G, without violating G's free will. For example, parents may not want their children to begin smoking. They know that people usually take up smoking in order to be acceptable to their peers, and so the parents introduce their children to a number of other young people who do not smoke, so that the children might befriend them, and have no need to smoke in order to be acceptable with them. The parents haven't violated their children's free will, and yet, there is a sense in which the parents have "forced" their children not to smoke (since they arranged circumstances such that they would be less likely to smoke). In case you think this is a strained use of "force", I refer you to a dictionary definition, in part, of the noun "force":

That by which something is accomplished : agent, agency, channel, instrument, instrumentality, intermediation, means, organ, vehicle...

---------------------------------------------------------
Excerpted from American Heritage Talking Dictionary
Copyright © 1997 The Learning Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved.


We can see from this definiton that force can be applied without compulsion. I this is exactly the manner in which God is "forcing" everyone into the Kingdom. He is arranging matters so that everyone will freely choose to enter it. Because of man's free will, many will choose to resist until death. In Gehenna, the "force" will increase, through suffering, and through the witness of the saints. But eventually, all will willingly bow the knee, and praise God, "all in heaven, on earth, and under the earth."

When we compare the quoted passage with Matthew 11:12, some might conclude that the latter contradicts this exegesis. For no apparent reason, translators assume the passive voice for "biazetai" in Matthew 11:12. But if we assume the middle, we may translate it as follows:

Now from the days of John the baptizer until now, the Kingdom of God forces itself, and forceful ones snatch it.

Translating it as "the Kingdom of God forces itself" corresponds to the passage in Luke, "since then the Gospel of the Kingdom is being proclaimed". This is how the Kingdom of God is being "forced" upon people ---- through the proclamation of the Gospel! Those whom God has chosen to proclaim the gospel, constitute the major means by which God now "forces" the kingdom upon people, that is, brings about circumstances so that people are more likely to freely choose to become disciples of Christ.

Some violent people who are used to getting their way by force, "snatch" the kingdom quickly when they come to see the benefits of entering it. Ironically, the violent may be more prone to enter it than the more peaceful ones.

So what are we to conclude concering Luke 16:16?

The law and the prophets were until John. Since then, the Gospel of the Kingdom of God is being proclaimed and everyone is forced into it.

Does it not appear to teach that God is "forcing" everyone into the Kingdom? That is, arranging matters so that each and every person will, sooner or later, choose to enter the Kingdom of God? Is this not yet another pillar of support for the truth of the ultimate reconciliation of all to God?
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Post by _TK » Wed Feb 06, 2008 3:01 pm

NKJV:
“The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it.


KJV:
The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.
NLT:
Until John the Baptist, the law of Moses and the messages of the prophets were your guides. But now the Good News of the Kingdom of God is preached, and everyone is eager to get in.
using the passive voice is bad writing. perhaps that is why we should not assume the passive voice was intended. i can still see the red writing on my themes-- "avoid the passive voice."

Matt. 11:12- NLT:
And from the time John the Baptist began preaching until now, the Kingdom of Heaven has been forcefully advancing, and violent people are attacking it.
NKJV:
And from the time John the Baptist began preaching until now, the Kingdom of Heaven has been forcefully advancing, and violent people are attacking it.


AMP:
And from the days of John the Baptist until the present time, the kingdom of heaven has endured violent assault, and violent men seize it by force [as a precious prize--a share in the heavenly kingdom is sought with most ardent zeal and intense exertion].
The matthew versions seem to imply that violence (at least in pursuing the Kingdom) is a desirable quality. an athlete who really wants the prize is going to train until it hurts. people who really want to enter God's kingdom will do anything to get in.

I just dont see why we have to read these passages in the sense that God is "forcing" people into the kingdom (even if it is an indirect force). Jesus always talked about how difficult it was to enter the kingdom. these verses, as originally translated, support this idea. if you aren't willing to be "violent", or aggressive, you may not get in.

TK
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Post by __id_2533 » Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:57 pm

Paidion asked:
Does it not appear to teach that God is "forcing" everyone into the Kingdom? That is, arranging matters to that each and every person will, sooner or later, choose to enter the Kingdom of God? Is this not yet another pillar of support for the truth of the ultimate reconciliation of all to God?
Indeed! And it is in accordance to His stated will too! Thank you brother!

Peace, dmatic
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Post by _Paidion » Wed Feb 06, 2008 8:25 pm

TK wrote:using the passive voice is bad writing. perhaps that is why we should not assume the passive voice was intended. i can still see the red writing on my themes-- "avoid the passive voice."
Active good. Passive bad. Eh?

Actually, the use of the passive voice is not bad writing per se. Rather using the passive voice too often can result in weaker assertions.

In the Greek New Testament, the passive voice is definitely used sometimes.

1 Corinthians 15:20 But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who have fallen asleep.

Paul could have written, "But in fact, God raised Christ from the dead" (active voice), but he chose to use the passive. Paul actually did put it this way in two verses, and Luke did so in 6 verses in Acts:

Romans 10:9 because, if you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
1 Corinthians 6:14 And God raised the Lord and will also raise us up by his power.
Acts 2:32 This Jesus God raised up, and of that we all are witnesses.
Acts 3:15 and killed the Author of life, whom God raised from the dead. To this we are witnesses.
Acts 4:10 be it known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead, by him this man is standing before you well.
Acts 10:40 but God raised him on the third day and made him manifest;
Acts 13:30 But God raised him from the dead;
Acts 13:37 but he whom God raised up saw no corruption.
Romans 10:9 because, if you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
1 Corinthians 6:14 And God raised the Lord and will also raise us up by his power.


Perhaps it is for reasons of "good writing" that some translators have incorrectly used the active voice for the passive in some verses:

Matthew 28:6 He is not here; for he has risen, as he said. Come, see the place where he lay. RSV

That is not what the passage says. It uses the passive voice. The Philips translation has it right:

Matthew 28:6 He is not here––he has been raised, just as be said. Come and look at the place where be was lying.

The King James and some of the related translations also have it right:

Matthew 28:7 And go quickly, and tell his disciples that he is risen from the dead; and, behold, he goeth before you into Galilee; there shall ye see him: lo, I have told you.

"He isrisen" is passive (older English); "He has risen" is active.

There is quite a difference between saying, "The dog has eaten" and "The dog is eaten."

I find it fascinating that not a single Easter hymn indicates that Christ was raised from death by God. They all make it appear that he raised himself up. It makes me wonder whether these hymn writers "believe in their heart that God raised him from the dead."
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Post by _Homer » Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:25 am

Paidion,

you wrote:

I find it fascinating that not a single Easter hymn indicates that Christ was raised from death by God. They all make it appear that he raised himself up. It makes me wonder whether these hymn writers "believe in their heart that God raised him from the dead."
Perhaps the hymn writers were influenced by Jesus' statement:

John 10:17-19 (New King James Version)

17. “Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again. 18. No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This command I have received from My Father.”


Come to think of it, the interchangeable use of God and Jesus in the resurrection is rather Trinitarian. Never thought of it before!
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Post by _TK » Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:41 am

this may be a tad off-topic, but i have always wondered who raised Jesus- Jesus himself or God the Father. the bible suggests both things, but i have wondered if Jesus was dead, how could he raise himself? but if God the father raised him, how does this "prove" the deity of Jesus, since several people were raised from the dead who were not deity?

TK
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Post by _Paidion » Thu Feb 07, 2008 11:46 am

17. “Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again.
18. No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This command I have received from My Father.”
Homer, I see no reason to think that Jesus is speaking here particularly of his death and resurrection.

The word translated as "life" us not "zōā" which refers to physical life, but "psychā" which means "self" (often translated as "soul"). Jesus said these words in the context of a good shepherd laying down his self (his own self-interests) for the sake of his sheep. Jesus didn't live for himself, but laid down his self for the sake of others during his walk on earth. This, of course, included his laying down his self in death for our sake. The idea is much the same as Jesus himself taught:

He who loves his self destroys it (the self), and he who discounts his self in this world system keeps it for æonian life. John 12:25

Jesus says that he lays down the self-life that he might take it, or have it again. He says in verse 18 not that he has power to take it again,(that is a mistranslation)but authority to take it again --- that is, take it again for himself to live the true life after the Father raises him.

Then comes the remarkable statement: "This command I received from my Father." Which command was that? Was it the command to take up his self again? Or was it the command to lay down his life in order that he might take it up again? I suggest the latter.
TK you wrote:this may be a tad off-topic, but i have always wondered who raised Jesus- Jesus himself or God the Father. the bible suggests both things
Care to quote the passages which "suggest" that he raised himself?
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Post by _TK » Thu Feb 07, 2008 4:50 pm

paidion wrote:
Care to quote the passages which "suggest" that he raised himself?
well, i thought i could- but i did a quick check and i guess that i can't. where'd i get that crazy idea from?

anyways- i still wonder about the second part of my question- if God the Father raised Jesus from the dead, how does this establish the deity of Jesus? i always thought this was one of the "proofs" of his deity but now i am not so sure about the proof aspect.

TK
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Post by _Michelle » Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:31 pm

TK, what about this one:

John 2:19-22
  • 19 Jesus answered and said to them, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up."
    20 Then the Jews said, "It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?"
    21 But He was speaking of the temple of His body. 22 Therefore, when He had risen from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this to them; and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had said.
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Post by _Paidion » Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:50 pm

I knew someone was going to post that one. It is the only verse in the whole New Testament that could be interpreted as saying that Jesus would raise himself from the dead..

For that reason, I think that interpretation is incorrect.

I think in that passage Jesus was prophesying. The Father was speaking through him, and uttering those words, saying that he (The Father) would raise up Jesus if someone destroyed Jesus' "temple" (his body).
TK wrote:anyways- i still wonder about the second part of my question- if God the Father raised Jesus from the dead, how does this establish the deity of Jesus? i always thought this was one of the "proofs" of his deity but now i am not so sure about the proof aspect.
There are plenty of other passages which indicate that Jesus is deity.
It is not necessary to imagine that Jesus raised himself in order to support this truth.

I believe that when Jesus died, he was really dead, just as anyone else who dies is. That's the wonderful part! Jesus really died for us! It wasn't just his body that died, while his bodiless spirit ascended to heaven. That fact may be verified from Jesus' own words after the Father raised him to life.

He said to [Mary], "Do not hold me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brethren and say to them, I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God." John 21:17 RSV
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