The Penalty For Getting It Wrong

robbyyoung · Post by **robbyyoung** » Wed Nov 05, 2014 8:12 am

Brother jaydam, from his last post, inspired me to address another issue concerning The Revelation. This is found in the closing remarks of the book, 22:18-19.

I contend that those who were not 100% accurate in teaching and preaching The Revelation were guilty. The urgency of the message was nothing to trifle with and those 1st Century false prophets and teachers, no doubt, were found guilty in the end.

Therefore, what about those who fall short post 70AD? Those who believe The Full Preterist position to be false, and subscribe to Futurism, teaching and preaching what The Revelation IS and IS NOT - well they better be 100% accurate! Else every last one of them are guilty of 22:18-19! Which is all the reason more they should abandon and rethink their position.

I thank God these dear souls will not be found guilty, because it didn't apply to them. Remember, the testimony is to EVERY MAN who hears, and then alters its meaning in the slightest!

Yes, God provided only qualified men of the time to get it right, separating the true prophets from the false, as God always does.

Your thoughts...

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Robby Young
U.S. Army Retired

steve · Post by **steve** » Wed Nov 05, 2014 10:07 am

If the closing verses in Revelation are a curse upon everyone who misunderstands the book, then the book has been no blessing to the Body of Christ generally, since most people who have read it will have misunderstood it and brought curses upon them that would not have come had it never been written.

I actually think that the curses upon those who add or subtract from the words of the book may be a warning to those who, through the generations, would copy and preserve the book. If so, even then, someone has some judgment coming, since the book is so poorly preserved, with so many variants, in manuscript copies.

robbyyoung · Post by **robbyyoung** » Wed Nov 05, 2014 11:24 am

steve wrote:If the closing verses in Revelation are a curse upon everyone who misunderstands the book, then the book has been no blessing to the Body of Christ generally, since most people who have read it will have misunderstood it and brought curses upon them that would not have come had it never been written.

Hi Steve, I'm sure if you exegetically apply audience relevance to the context the warning is clear. In the 1st Century, with all that was coming to a head, especially false prophets leading many astray, those who HEARD this prophecy and were not qualified to get it right, and by default, added or took away from its true meaning were cursed. IMHO I see no reason to make this difficult. If we divorce 22:18-19 from its era, I see why people should be concerned! And rightfully so.

steve wrote:I actually think that the curses upon those who add or subtract from the words of the book may be a warning to those who, through the generations, would copy and preserve the book.

Steve, I strongly disagree. The warning is about hearing, therefore, God was responsible for the qualified mouth piece. The problem lies with those who heard and rejected the truth, altered its meaning and proceeded to apparently teach or prophesy their lie. The time was short and serious. The Believers had to persevere and not get deceived, and so those guilty of the charge were cursed.

God Bless.

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Robby Young
U.S. Army Retired

dizerner · Post by **dizerner** » Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:01 pm

[user account removed]

robbyyoung · Post by **robbyyoung** » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:28 pm

dizerner wrote:To be honest, I'm not sure even the Apostle John knew what all those visions meant.

No dizerner, I disagree. John was qualified, as all the NT Prophets were, to correctly, and accurately give the Prophecy and it's meaning. Just because we only get snippets of the time, doesn't mean the exhaustive narrative wasn't discussed. Nevertheless, the internal evidence, again, helps us out - Rev 10:4-11, John was told to "seal up" what the 7 thunders uttered and eat "the little book", both of which, are unknown to us and only revealed to that 1st Century group of Believers! John was to prophesy again. This is just one more reason or proof this prophecy belongs, fulfilled, in the past.

On a side note: It wasn't an angelic being, if this is what you mean, it was a human, which is another BIG MYSTERY!

God Bless.

steve7150 · Post by **steve7150** » Wed Nov 05, 2014 7:11 pm

If anyone adds to these things , God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book, and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy , God shall take away his part from the Book of Life" 22.18 - 19

To me it's clearly a warning not to alter the book, as in "adds" or "takes away."

robbyyoung · Post by **robbyyoung** » Wed Nov 05, 2014 8:57 pm

steve7150 wrote:If anyone adds to these things , God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book, and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy , God shall take away his part from the Book of Life" 22.18 - 19

To me it's clearly a warning not to alter the book, as in "adds" or "takes away."

Hi Steve7150,

Yes, Steve pretty much subscribes to this as well, but let's consider it again:

(KJV) For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things,...

"This Book" is singular, is it not?

"These Things" (tauta), is plural, is it not?

Therefore, "The Prophecy" in "The Book" attested to MANY THINGS as it was being read and subsequently HEARD. The curse is due to adding to THE THINGS "HEARD". Whether these people vocalized it, wrote it down, or both - THE THINGS that were written were sufficient, and interpretation was to be done by qualified individuals.

Again, here's what we have:

1. Urgency (time is short)
2. A book or scroll written and copied at least 7 times by John or his scribes
3. Sent out to 7 Churches in Asia
4. Read and interpreted by qualified men in those Churches
5. As the people heard the message, they were not to add or subtract from THE THINGS they HEARD
6. If they are guilty, the curse will be upon them. The Plagues they were to suffer are within THE SAME TIME SENSITIVE bookends attributed to the 1st Century

"God shall add to him the plagues that have been written in this book,..."

Extremely important - The Plagues are not outside the bookends of the prophecy, therefore, those guilty fall within the prophecy's NEAR FULFILLMENT and cannot denote a different time, people, and place.

God Bless.

steve7150 · Post by **steve7150** » Wed Nov 05, 2014 9:18 pm

steve7150 wrote:
If anyone adds to these things , God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book, and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy , God shall take away his part from the Book of Life" 22.18 - 19

To me it's clearly a warning not to alter the book, as in "adds" or "takes away."

Hi Steve7150,

Yes, Steve pretty much subscribes to this as well, but let's consider it again:

(KJV) For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things,...

"This Book" is singular, is it not?

"These Things" (tauta), is plural, is it not?

Therefore, "The Prophecy" in "The Book" attested to MANY THINGS as it was being read and subsequently HEARD. The curse is due to adding to THE THINGS "HEARD". Whether these people vocalized it, wrote it down, or both - THE THINGS that were written were sufficient, and interpretation was to be done by qualified individuals.Robby,

The warning simply says don't add or take away from the words. The rest of your interpretation is not based on the actual scripture but on your 70AD presupposition.

Homer · Post by **Homer** » Wed Nov 05, 2014 11:34 pm

Robby,

Am I understanding you correctly? You seem to be saying that hearing the word applies to the hearer but if it is just read by us later it is inapplicable?

Jesus said:

Matthew 7:24-28 (NASB)

24. “Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock. 25. And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and yet it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock. 26. Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand. 27. The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell—and great was its fall.”

Doesn't the teaching of Jesus in the SOM apply equally to those who heard it and those who read it today?

robbyyoung · Post by **robbyyoung** » Thu Nov 06, 2014 6:15 am

steve7150 wrote:The warning simply says don't add or take away from the words.

Yep!

steve7150 wrote:The rest of your interpretation is not based on the actual scripture but on your 70AD presupposition.

Now that is funny! Ok, here we go again for the ump-teen time

:

1. History shows what was coming, happened in 70AD. Of course, they didn't know, but they knew it was NEAR.
2. What was coming? Rev 1:1"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass;..."
a. "THINGS"
b. From a PROPHECY
c. Coming soon to a 1st Century audience "History shows 70 AD"

3. Here's what we read at the END of THE PROPHECY; Rev 22:18 "For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:" Rev 22:20 "He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.
a. The same "THINGS"
b. The same PROPHECY
c. The same promise of coming soon to its 1st Century audience

And you say, steve7150, "The rest of your interpretation is not based on the actual scripture but on your 70AD presupposition."???????????????????????????

Funny, funny, too funny!!!!!!

God Bless.

The Narrow Path Ministries