Sin against the body

[RoyHobs]

those blog posts give off a bit of a bad vibe

Perhaps you could provide an example.

[Michelle]

those blog posts give off a bit of a bad vibe

Perhaps you could provide an example.

You removed the post where you broke down Matt Slick's article about virgins. I thought that post was kind of harsh.

[morbo3000]

Attn Roy:

You haven't answered my question:

"So, my daughters should marry the first man they had sex with. If they don't, then they will forever be living in adultery, even if they are married to someone who was not their first. Is that what you are saying?"

[RoyHobs]

Attn Roy:You haven't answered my question:

Matthew 19:11-
Jesus replied, “Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. For there are eunuchs who were born that way, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by others—and there are those who choose to live like eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it.”

[morbo3000]

Roy: Have you had any opportunity to speak with singles or couples in your congregation about this? It's so important to you, I imagine you must be cautioning people in your church. What do the elders or pastor of your church have to say about it?

[morbo3000]

Roy asked me to clarify my question:

<snip>
I persist because your doctrine has real world application, and consequences. Some frequent debates on the board are about the trinity, how to interpret the bible, specific passages. But having different opinions on the dating of job is not a sin. Or belief that moses was not the author of Jesus.

My church provides counsel and wisdom about these real word applications that the board cannot. Checks and balances.

So, I'm wondering, how has your church responded to your beliefs? Do they accept them? What does your pastor and elders think? Have you counseled people?

Real world examples are what I'm looking for. We know the scriptures you use. And what they say about the narrow path. How does it play out in your life?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[RomneyWordsworth]

Attn Roy:

You haven't answered my question:

"So, my daughters should marry the first man they had sex with. If they don't, then they will forever be living in adultery, even if they are married to someone who was not their first. Is that what you are saying?"

Hi Morbo: I think Roy is hoping you'll see the answer in the scripture for yourself, rather than him tell you. But for those of us who want direct answers that apply to our real world situations, let me attempt to provide the direct
applications of what Roy is saying (and that he believes?). Roy, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on this, but it seems apparently clear the answer to morbo's questions are:

1. As long any man is alive on this earth that your daughters have had sex with, if they are having sex with another, it is adultery.
2. Marrying the first man they had sex with will not work, it is also adultery, since they left him to have sex with another, even if they return, the relationship (in the flesh) has been adulterated and cannot be un-done.
3. The answer for them, is to separate from the current adulterous relationships they are in, and remain celibate for life, or at least until all their previous partners have died. Only death of all ex partners can release them.
4. The same applies to your wife, if she has ex partners living, she should be celibate for life.
5. If I understand Roy correctly, this is also a salvation issue because "life is but a flash, but eternity is forever", and "no adulterer or fornicator will enter the kingdom of heaven". Combining those statements with any woman
"having been made one flesh" with someone still living other than her current partner = adultery, means that they are living in continual, unrepentant adultery, so his reasoning is, how can they go to heaven? How can one
reconcile the two?
6. Though Roy hasn't said anything about non-virgin men involved with more than one woman, because of that very silence, the implication is, this does not apply to men, and it seems the bible also is silent or seems to support that view.

I have read every post in this thread from the start, and it seems clear that this is what he is saying and what the practical application is.

Roy, am I wrong on this? Can you correct any of the points above if they aren't true or don't apply?

[RomneyWordsworth]

I have another question about this topic. Years ago, I read in a woman's magazine (Redbook) "Our biggest poll ever", of about 30,000 women.
One of the questions asked the women was: "What one secret would you take with you to the grave, not ever telling a single person, your entire life?"

85 percent of them filled in the same answer: "How many men I had slept with." (Note: This does not mean the other 15 percent didn't sleep with multiple partners, it
merely means they didn't or wouldn't keep it a secret to their grave).

Question for Roy: Part one: Let's say I'm dating a Christian widow, who told me that she has only "had" one man: her deceased husband. Wanting to be a pure Christian and not commit adultery,
I believe I am free to become one flesh with her, and so I have sex with her and become "one flesh" and we commit for life until death do us part.

But in reality, she is one of the 85 percent (or more) of women who simply would never tell you, even to the moment they die. So, in reality, her flesh IS already joined to
another (or more) living men, and in reality, I would be living in adultery, since my ignorance of her living ex sexual partners does not change the fact of the condition of her flesh.

Part two: Imagine if went into and became one flesh for life a girl who told me she was a virgin, but in reality was not, but she had a procedure done to restore her hymen. Like
the case above, regardless of my ignorance, in reality she is still one flesh with another living man, but has moved on to live with me.

My question is: In either or both of the cases above, will the man (me) go to hell, because he was living in unrepentant adultery all the way up to the day he died?

And for Michelle: As a woman, would you say that Redbook poll is true?

[Michelle]

I have another question about this topic. Years ago, I read in a woman's magazine (Redbook) "Our biggest poll ever", of about 30,000 women.
One of the questions asked the women was: "What one secret would you take with you to the grave, not ever telling a single person, your entire life?"

85 percent of them filled in the same answer: "How many men I had slept with." (Note: This does not mean the other 15 percent didn't sleep with multiple partners, it
merely means they didn't or wouldn't keep it a secret to their grave).

(I cut out Roy's questions)

And for Michelle: As a woman, would you say that Redbook poll is true?

Hmm...that's an interesting question. I agree that secular women do tend to lie about their sexual experiences, but 85% seems to me to be a pretty high number. Perhaps this was a multiple choice question and the other choices were more inane? For me, my "number" (as it's sometimes referred to) is my business with God, like my age or weight. I guess if someone asked me, I would cough it up, but no one ever asks me. No one. Ever. And, for the record, I believe my sinful past has been redeemed and my sins forgiven through repentance and Jesus's blood. For the life of me, I cannot think of a secret I would take to my grave. Maybe other people's sins that I know about and which have been forgiven, so why should I speak of them?

[RomneyWordsworth]

I have another question about this topic. Years ago, I read in a woman's magazine (Redbook) "Our biggest poll ever", of about 30,000 women.
One of the questions asked the women was: "What one secret would you take with you to the grave, not ever telling a single person, your entire life?"

85 percent of them filled in the same answer: "How many men I had slept with." (Note: This does not mean the other 15 percent didn't sleep with multiple partners, it
merely means they didn't or wouldn't keep it a secret to their grave).

(I cut out Roy's questions)

And for Michelle: As a woman, would you say that Redbook poll is true?

Hmm...that's an interesting question. I agree that secular women do tend to lie about their sexual experiences, but 85% seems to me to be a pretty high number. Perhaps this was a multiple choice question and the other choices were more inane? For me, my "number" (as it's sometimes referred to) is my business with God, like my age or weight. I guess if someone asked me, I would cough it up, but no one ever asks me. No one. Ever. And, for the record, I believe my sinful past has been redeemed and my sins forgiven through repentance and Jesus's blood. For the life of me, I cannot think of a secret I would take to my grave. Maybe other people's sins that I know about and which have been forgiven, so why should I speak of them?

Thanks for the honest response. I can say from my own experience and that of others, that often times when we have sinned, the devil puts thoughts in our head that "you're the only one", "nobody else is like you","don't tell anyone" etc.Especially victims of sexual abuse think this, and the devil's specialty is to keep them all isolated from each other. But when one comes out...it encourages the others and you see a glimpse how many more there really are. (Bill Cosby for example, the Catholic Priest scandal another, etc.)

My point is, that when answering a private, anonymous poll, an answer to a question like that is more likely to be honest. If I recall, that answer was a fill-in answer, which makes it even more remarkable. I think that in a sense, they probably delighted at the chance to tell the truth, like a confession, without the public discovery and consequences. So I think that each woman respondent was probably thinking the same thing, that "there's probably not that many women out there like me", but then, surprise surprise, look at the results. They were all just keeping it inside, but I don't blame them, I can understand why.

I am glad to hear and rejoice that you have been saved and forgiven. I wish I could ask more questions to get a woman's perspective... like, even though you're saved, forgiven, and washed clean, do you feel you could still give yourself to,
bond with, and love a man, with the same innocence, purity, and degree, to which you could when you were a physical virgin? Without feeling any longing, soul ties, or love, for past partners? Has Christ's blood, love, and forgiveness regenerated you to that degree?