I quite by accident stumbled upon Ellis Skolfield and found that he has a unique historicist view of Revelation that appeals to my reasoning. I don't find the idea of using reasoning to interpret highly symbolic portions of the bible to be a bad idea in fact sometimes it's a really good idea. So based on my reasoning i think the Historicist view of Revelation is the view that makes the most sense to me and if this view is true then there is no way that Islam can be omitted. From the natural perspective Islam will overrun Europe in a couple of generations based on current birthrates. So what it tried and barely failed to do with the sword it may do by attrition. In fact if current birthrates continue in a couple of generations half the world will be muslim and ultimately be under Sharria law. So in the natural it seems like an inevitable event but i think God has other plans. Islam is unique among religions in that it does not only present it's own path but it openly claims that Christianity is false by countering it's claim about Jesus dying on the cross. In the Quran It claims that someone died on the cross in his place and that the bible is corrupted so in doing this Islam places itself as a direct opposition to the claims of the bible.
In his book "The False Prophet" Skollfield uses math to prove to his satisfaction that many prophecies from Daniel and Revelation relate to the Dome of the Rock and Israel and Islam. So i intend to list them and hope for some feedback for or against.
According Skollfield in 533BC Daniel was given a prophecy concerning "his people", "And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away and the abomination that makes desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days." Dan 12.11
Skollfield believes that the principal of a day for a prophetic year is applicable here so the period really is 1,290 years. Skollfield claims the date the daily sacrifices stopped was 583 BC based on Jeremiah 52.30.
"In the three and twentieth year of Nebuchadnezzar, Nebuzaradan the captain of the guard carried away captive of the Jews seven hundred forty and five persons." Jer 52.30 According To Skolfield Nebuchadnezzae took the throne of Babylon in 606BC and 23 years later comes to 583BC. So the sacrifices ended when the last Jews were carried off in 583BC. If you then convert the 1,290 Hebrew years to 1,271.5 Solar years we come to 688AD the year the construction of the Dome of the Rock began.
So according to Skolfield the Dome of the Rock is the Abomination of Desolation in Dan 12.11.
The False Prophet by Ellis Skolfield
Re: The False Prophet by Ellis Skolfield
There was a time when I was very impressed by Ellis' calculations. If math based eschatology is the proper approach then I think his paradigm is at the top of the list. However, I eventually realized that the rest of his approach was lacking in explanatory value when it came to covenant transformation in the New Testament. In addition, the 3 1/2 year period (whether it was 1260, 42 months, or 3 1/2 years) fit too cleanly with the Roman war for his math to have a lock on measuring how time worked in the Bible.
Doug
Doug
Re: The False Prophet by Ellis Skolfield
There was a time when I was very impressed by Ellis' calculations. If math based eschatology is the proper approach then I think his paradigm is at the top of the list. However, I eventually realized that the rest of his approach was lacking in explanatory value when it came to covenant transformation in the New Testament. In addition, the 3 1/2 year period (whether it was 1260, 42 months, or 3 1/2 years) fit too cleanly with the Roman war for his math to have a lock on measuring how time worked in the Bible.
Doug
OK Doug thanks for your feedback.
Doug
OK Doug thanks for your feedback.
Re: The False Prophet by Ellis Skolfield
According to ES,
Rev 12.6 "And the women fled into the wilderness where she had a place prepared by God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days."
ES applies the day for a year rule to come up with, 688AD (the construction of the Dome of the Rock) adds 1,260 years until 1948 the birth of modern Israel.
ES note: Before 688AD both Christians and Jews could freely worship in Jerusalem and on the temple mount. They were not prophetically in the "wilderness" of the nations until the Muslims made it unsafe for them to worship in that city. That is why the 1,260 days begin in 688AD.
ES: Remember in Dan 12.9 when the Lord stated that Daniel's book would be sealed until the time of the end? Until the new nation of Israel became a historic reality (which began the time of the end)it was impossible to prove that Daniel's 1,260 days were fulfilled by the Dome of the Rock.
Rev 12.6 "And the women fled into the wilderness where she had a place prepared by God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days."
ES applies the day for a year rule to come up with, 688AD (the construction of the Dome of the Rock) adds 1,260 years until 1948 the birth of modern Israel.
ES note: Before 688AD both Christians and Jews could freely worship in Jerusalem and on the temple mount. They were not prophetically in the "wilderness" of the nations until the Muslims made it unsafe for them to worship in that city. That is why the 1,260 days begin in 688AD.
ES: Remember in Dan 12.9 when the Lord stated that Daniel's book would be sealed until the time of the end? Until the new nation of Israel became a historic reality (which began the time of the end)it was impossible to prove that Daniel's 1,260 days were fulfilled by the Dome of the Rock.
Re: The False Prophet by Ellis Skolfield
I agree that he has some interesting and compelling arguments. But, he has a hard time with the standard audience relevance arguments of the New Testament. For instance, he doesn't talk much about the Olivet Discourse or how promises made to members of first century churches were successfully fulfilled (e.g., 2nd Thess. 1). I suppose my kids will know one way or another because if I understood him right there is a sort of generation clock running in association with the founding of Israel, so that things have to wrap up in the next few decades. I'm betting they won't.
Doug
Doug
Re: The False Prophet by Ellis Skolfield
For instance, he doesn't talk much about the Olivet Discourse or how promises made to members of first century churches were successfully fulfilled (e.g., 2nd Thess. 1). I suppose my kids will know one way or another because if I understood him right there is a sort of generation clock running in association with the founding of Israel, so that things have to wrap up in the next few decades. I'm betting they won't.
Correct because his view is not about 70AD. As i also have disclosed previously, I have a hard time making sense of the logic that Revelation can be mostly about 70AD since that info had been clearly revealed in straightforward language previously in the NT. Also the New Covenant had been described many times before Revelation. After all a "revelation" is supposed to unveil new info previously not known.
Correct because his view is not about 70AD. As i also have disclosed previously, I have a hard time making sense of the logic that Revelation can be mostly about 70AD since that info had been clearly revealed in straightforward language previously in the NT. Also the New Covenant had been described many times before Revelation. After all a "revelation" is supposed to unveil new info previously not known.
Re: The False Prophet by Ellis Skolfield
Rev 11.2 "But the court which is without the temple leave out and measure it not, for it is given unto the Gentiles and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months."
According to ES - "Leave out the court, it has been given to the Gentiles" has come to pass because the Dome of the Rock is 300 feet south of the temple and is right in the middle of the Court of the Gentiles.
Using the Solar calender because this is a New Testament time frame we arrive at 42 months X 30.44 average days per month = 1,278.5 days.
1967AD - 1278.5 (day for a year) = 688.5 back to the Dome of the Rock. 1967 is when Israel recaptured Jerusalem and the Gentiles lost control of this location.
According to ES - "Leave out the court, it has been given to the Gentiles" has come to pass because the Dome of the Rock is 300 feet south of the temple and is right in the middle of the Court of the Gentiles.
Using the Solar calender because this is a New Testament time frame we arrive at 42 months X 30.44 average days per month = 1,278.5 days.
1967AD - 1278.5 (day for a year) = 688.5 back to the Dome of the Rock. 1967 is when Israel recaptured Jerusalem and the Gentiles lost control of this location.
Re: The False Prophet by Ellis Skolfield
That's an excellent example of some of the really impressive math involved in Ellis Skolfield's system. There's more to it if anyone is interested. "The False Prophet" can be found for free on the Internet as a PDF.steve7150 wrote:Rev 11.2 "But the court which is without the temple leave out and measure it not, for it is given unto the Gentiles and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months."
According to ES - "Leave out the court, it has been given to the Gentiles" has come to pass because the Dome of the Rock is 300 feet south of the temple and is right in the middle of the Court of the Gentiles.
Using the Solar calender because this is a New Testament time frame we arrive at 42 months X 30.44 average days per month = 1,278.5 days.
1967AD - 1278.5 (day for a year) = 688.5 back to the Dome of the Rock. 1967 is when Israel recaptured Jerusalem and the Gentiles lost control of this location.
But, my problem is the overall view of how Revelation and Daniel integrate into the rest of scripture. I don't think that Ellis believes that Revelation is supposed to be a new stand alone series of predictions. Revelation 15 declares that the conclusion of eschatology is tied to the Song of Moses from Deuteronomy 32. Deuteronomy 32 sets the tone for eschatology throughout scripture, and is the song of doom against the apostate members of the nation at the time that the New Covenant will be fully implemented. Jesus declares in Matt. 23-25 that the doom of Jerusalem is tied to judgement against the nation that has been building up since its beginning. Revelation 20:4-6, 11-15 describe Daniel 7 and 12. However you handle it, they are tightly integrated. I don't see Ellis penetrating the narrative of the Old Covenant nation transitioning to the New Covenant.
Doug
Re: The False Prophet by Ellis Skolfield
Jesus declares in Matt. 23-25 that the doom of Jerusalem is tied to judgement against the nation that has been building up since its beginning. Revelation 20:4-6, 11-15 describe Daniel 7 and 12. However you handle it, they are tightly integrated. I don't see Ellis penetrating the narrative of the Old Covenant nation transitioning to the New Covenant.
The message of the Old Covenant nation transitioning to the New Covenant is in many places in scripture prior to Revelation so ES has a different vision which is that Revelation describes the Church Age.
The message of the Old Covenant nation transitioning to the New Covenant is in many places in scripture prior to Revelation so ES has a different vision which is that Revelation describes the Church Age.
Identity of the Leopard-Bear-Lion according to ES
As most agree the first three beasts in Daniel 7 are Lion = Babylon & Bear = Medo Persia & Leopard = Greece. This geographic area of these kingdoms covers
the middle east of today. The Leopard-Bear-Lion beast of Rev 13 comes after the prophecy of Rev 11.2 but may be a parallel account.
Rev 11.2 "But the court which is without the temple leave out and measure it not, for it is given unto the Gentiles and the Holy City shall they tread under foot forty and two months." According to ES this period is 1278.34 solar years from 688.66 AD (Dome of the Rock begins construction) to 1967AD. 1967 was when Israel regained control of the temple area.
In Rev 13 the Leopard-Bear-Lion (LBL) was granted authority authority over Jerusalem for 42 months.
Rev 13.5 "And there was given unto him (LBL) a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months."
So Rev 11.2 and 13.5 are parallel accounts of the same event. Both are about the Islamic control of Jerusalem from 688 to 1967.
You may think that Islam is not a kingdom so it can't be a beast but it is not only a religion but a method of governing the populace and it is the common thread that unites all the middle eastern countries which are all Islamic except Israel. Islam can also be considered a spiritual kingdom which covers the geographic area of the Daniel beasts.
the middle east of today. The Leopard-Bear-Lion beast of Rev 13 comes after the prophecy of Rev 11.2 but may be a parallel account.
Rev 11.2 "But the court which is without the temple leave out and measure it not, for it is given unto the Gentiles and the Holy City shall they tread under foot forty and two months." According to ES this period is 1278.34 solar years from 688.66 AD (Dome of the Rock begins construction) to 1967AD. 1967 was when Israel regained control of the temple area.
In Rev 13 the Leopard-Bear-Lion (LBL) was granted authority authority over Jerusalem for 42 months.
Rev 13.5 "And there was given unto him (LBL) a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months."
So Rev 11.2 and 13.5 are parallel accounts of the same event. Both are about the Islamic control of Jerusalem from 688 to 1967.
You may think that Islam is not a kingdom so it can't be a beast but it is not only a religion but a method of governing the populace and it is the common thread that unites all the middle eastern countries which are all Islamic except Israel. Islam can also be considered a spiritual kingdom which covers the geographic area of the Daniel beasts.