Hi Steve,
We were just listening to your Daniel series up here in T-bay [Thunder Bay, Ontario] and I was wondering if Dan 12:2-3 would have any merit as possibly applying to the idea that when Jesus made a way for us to come into God's presence, Sheol was 'opened' and the righteous who were waiting went to God's presence (Heaven) and the wicked went to (Hell)....
As I ask the question, I'm wondering what other scriptures even support my assumption.. I'm thinking about the Jesus' words to the thief on the cross..
As a reminder, you taught that v2-3 were referring to the final judgment at the end of time...
Thanks
Looking forward to Revelation and Ezekial too!
Les
Daniel 12:2-3
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_Les Wright
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Daniel 12:2-3
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
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Hi Les,
I have always found Daniel 12:1-3 to be difficult to interpret, and, as I recall, my position has never thoroughly been nailed down in my tapes. Your suggestion can be included among the possibilities, though I don't know that it strikes me as the best possible option. I have held different views on this at different times of my life.
The "time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation, even to that time" (v.1) sounds an awful lot like Jesus' statement, "Then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time" (Matt.24:21), and may be identical in meaning. A simple comparison of this statement in Matthew 24 with its parallel in Luke 21:20-24 indicates that Jesus is referring to the great trials that began to befall the Jews in the Jewish War (66-70 AD)—though there is no mention of how long this "tribulation" was to continue, and it may be implied that it lasts "until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled" (Luke 21:24), which I take to be the end of the present age. If this is how we are to understand this, then the "great tribulation," of which Jesus (and possibly Daniel) spoke, would begin with the Jewish troubles in the first century and continue through the entirety of what we usually call "the Church Age'—ending with the second coming of Christ Himself.
This would suggest that Daniel 12:1-3 summarizes the whole period from 66 AD to the end of the world: i.e., Disaster befalls the Jewish capital and state at the hands of the Romans, and at the hands of others over the following centuries (e.g., in the Crusades, Russian pogroms, Nazi Holocaust, modern suicide bombers, etc.), but those of Daniel's people who are "written in the book" (v.1) will be saved (i.e., the believing remnant of Israel [Luke 10:20], joined by the believing Gentiles [Rev.3:5])—a process that lasts for several centuries—at the end of which there is resurrection and judgment (vv.2-3).
There are other possibilities of interpretation, and mine, like all others, has a few problems (e.g., why would the resurrection, which includes "ALL who are in the graves"—John 5:28—be spoken of as "MANY of those who sleep"—Dan.12:2? Why not "ALL"?), but I consider it to be the least problematic position presently known to me.
I appreciate your suggestion. For the scriptural basis of your original assumption about Christ emptying hades, etc., you might find helpful my answer to another inquirer at this forum (under "Misc. Theological Topics") on the question labeled, "Jesus in hell?"
I have always found Daniel 12:1-3 to be difficult to interpret, and, as I recall, my position has never thoroughly been nailed down in my tapes. Your suggestion can be included among the possibilities, though I don't know that it strikes me as the best possible option. I have held different views on this at different times of my life.
The "time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation, even to that time" (v.1) sounds an awful lot like Jesus' statement, "Then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time" (Matt.24:21), and may be identical in meaning. A simple comparison of this statement in Matthew 24 with its parallel in Luke 21:20-24 indicates that Jesus is referring to the great trials that began to befall the Jews in the Jewish War (66-70 AD)—though there is no mention of how long this "tribulation" was to continue, and it may be implied that it lasts "until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled" (Luke 21:24), which I take to be the end of the present age. If this is how we are to understand this, then the "great tribulation," of which Jesus (and possibly Daniel) spoke, would begin with the Jewish troubles in the first century and continue through the entirety of what we usually call "the Church Age'—ending with the second coming of Christ Himself.
This would suggest that Daniel 12:1-3 summarizes the whole period from 66 AD to the end of the world: i.e., Disaster befalls the Jewish capital and state at the hands of the Romans, and at the hands of others over the following centuries (e.g., in the Crusades, Russian pogroms, Nazi Holocaust, modern suicide bombers, etc.), but those of Daniel's people who are "written in the book" (v.1) will be saved (i.e., the believing remnant of Israel [Luke 10:20], joined by the believing Gentiles [Rev.3:5])—a process that lasts for several centuries—at the end of which there is resurrection and judgment (vv.2-3).
There are other possibilities of interpretation, and mine, like all others, has a few problems (e.g., why would the resurrection, which includes "ALL who are in the graves"—John 5:28—be spoken of as "MANY of those who sleep"—Dan.12:2? Why not "ALL"?), but I consider it to be the least problematic position presently known to me.
I appreciate your suggestion. For the scriptural basis of your original assumption about Christ emptying hades, etc., you might find helpful my answer to another inquirer at this forum (under "Misc. Theological Topics") on the question labeled, "Jesus in hell?"
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
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In Jesus,
Steve
Steve