The Book of Life and Universalism

Post by **_Homer** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 12:58 am

In the scriptures, we read of the saved being "written in the book of life", and the lost are "not written in the book of life".

Luke 10:20 (all scriptures from NASB)

20. "Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rejoice that your names are recorded in heaven."

Here Jesus informs the seventy that their names are written in the book. "Recorded" is a perfect indicative passive: completed in the past with continuing results.

Philippians 4:3

3. Indeed, true companion, I ask you also to help these women who have shared my struggle in the cause of the gospel, together with Clement also and the rest of my fellow workers, whose names are in the book of life.

And here Paul speaks of his fellow laborers whose names are written in the book of life.

Revelation 13:8

8. All who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain.

And here John speaks of those who will worship the beast as not being in the book of life from the foundation of the world.

Revelation 17:8

8. The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come.

And again John refers to those who have not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world.

Revelation 20:11-15
11. Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them.
12. And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds.
13. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds.
14. Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire This is the second death, the lake of fire.
15. And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

And at the final judgement, those not found written in the book of life are thrown into the lake of fire. This would certainly appear to include those whose names were "not written in the book from the foundation of the world".

Revelation 21:21-27

21. And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; each one of the gates was a single pearl. And the street of the city was pure gold, like transparent glass.
22. I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb are its temple.
23. And the city has no need of the sun or of the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God has illumined it, and its lamp is the Lamb.
24. The nations will walk by its light, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it.
25. In the daytime (for there will be no night there) its gates will never be closed;
26. and they will bring the glory and the honor of the nations into it;
27. and nothing unclean, and no one who practices abomination and lying, shall ever come into it, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life.

And here we have heaven described and are informed that those whose names are wrtten in the book of life will be the only ones who can enter. The words "shall ever come into it" are an emphatic future negation: they will never in the future get in.

Post by **_Steve** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 4:36 am

Just a couple of observations:

The description in Revelation 21 is not of heaven, but of the New Jerusalem. Of course, most of what we carelsessly say about heaven (e.g., pearly gates, streets of gold, etc.) are really about the New Jerusalem, not heaven.

The New Jerusalem is apparently identified, throughout eternity, with the church (Heb.12:22-23), which is made up (I believe) only of those who are followers of Christ in this present age.

But (while I don't know how much to take symbolically, or with what signification) there are others said to be in the New Earth, who are not a part of the New Jerusalem:

"But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie." (Rev.22:15)

Interestingly, this is after we were told that "anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire." (Rev.20:15).

As I said, I don't know what to make of the symbolism, but on the face of it, it sounds like the same people who were cast into the lake of fire, in chapter 20:15 ("anyone not found written in the Book of Life"), are seen outside the New Jerusalem in chapter 22:15.

Curious.

Post by **_STEVE7150** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 8:25 am

12. And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds

It does'nt say "book of life " here it says "the books were opened" which i think are the gospels being read to the folks in the LOF. And if God judges the dead it is implicit in the word "judges" that there is proportional judgment.

Post by **_STEVE7150** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 8:33 am

But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie." (Rev.22:15)

Interestingly, this is after we were told that "anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire." (Rev.20:15).

As I said, I don't know what to make of the symbolism, but on the face of it, it sounds like the same people who were cast into the lake of fire, in chapter 20:15 ("anyone not found written in the Book of Life"), are seen outside the New Jerusalem in chapter 22:15.

Yes i think they are the same people or at least some who still remain and the saved must be "the Bride." And thus who is the "Bride" speaking to here?
"The Spirit and the Bride say , "Come and let the one who hears say, "Come" and let the one who is thirsty come, let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost." Rev 22.17

Post by **_Homer** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:46 am

Hi Steve,

You wrote:

"But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie." (Rev.22:15)

Interestingly, this is after we were told that "anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire." (Rev.20:15).

It seems to me that Revelation 22:6-21 is written as an epilogue. The second coming and judgement appears to have occured in chapters 19 and 20 while 22:7 speaks of judgement as having not yet taken place. Revelation appears to not be a chronological book as you have noted in the past.

The statement regarding "everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb" would seem to indicate that through God's foreknowledge they were omitted.

To keep it simple I refer to heaven and hell as the respective abodes of the saved and lost after judgement. I think it best in this discussion to not get sidetracked into other issues where there are differing opinions, but that's just me.

God bless, Homer

Post by **_Paidion** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:37 am

I'm not sure how the topic of the Book of Life relates to "universalism".
But I assume that Homer is hinting that those whose names were not written in the Lamb's book of life from the foundation of the world are forever doomed, and those whose names were written there are forever saved.

But it seems that those whose names are written there are not as secure as it seems.

Revelation 3:5 He who conquers shall be clad thus in white garments, and I will not blot his name out of the book of life; I will confess his name before my Father and before his angels.

The fact that the Lord states that He will not blot out the names of the overcomers or conquerers of sin at least suggests that those who do not overcome could have their names blotted out of the book

I would also like to point out that Rev 13:8 does not say that all the names in the Book of Life were written at the foundation of the world, but from the foundation of the world. I think ever since the foundation of the world, names have been written in that book. People's names are written there at the time they come to submit to the Father and the Son, and that if they don't continue to trust and obey, their names will be blotted out. Eventually all will submit and have their names written there. But as long as they don't, their names will not be there, and certainly they will be thrown into the Lake of Fire --- the purifying, cleansing fire of God, the best that God could do for these poor lost souls --- until they repent.

Post by **_Steve** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 12:27 pm

Homer,

You could well be right about the chronology.

Paidion,

You wrote:

"Rev 13:8 does not say that all the names in the Book of Life were written at the foundation of the world, but from the foundation of the world. I think ever since the foundation of the world, names have been written in that book."

That is an interesting, and potentially very helpful, observation. I am going to look into the possibilities of this understanding being correct. It would seemingly solve a long-time problem I have had between this verse and the verse about being blotted out of the book.

On the other hand, that meaning seems less workable in the context of Revelation 17:8—

"And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come."

Post by **_Suzana** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 2:57 pm

If Paidion's explanation is correct, perhaps it could read:
"And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not (at this time) been written in the book of life (which is being written in) from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come."

On the other hand, in this particular verse at first reading, I understood the 'from the foundation of the world' was referring to the lamb, not the book.
cf. analytical-literal translation:
And all the ones dwelling on the earth will prostrate themselves in worship before it, the name of whom has not been written in the Scroll of Life of the Lamb having been slain from [the] laying of the foundation of [the] world [or, from [the] beginning of the creation of [the] universe].

Post by **_Father_of_five** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 3:11 pm

Just to add some more scriptural data to this discussion, here is a passage from Exodus.

Ex 32:31-33
31 And Moses returned unto the LORD, and said, Oh, this people have sinned a great sin, and have made them gods of gold. 32 Yet now, if thou wilt forgive their sin--; and if not, blot me, I pray thee, out of thy book which thou hast written. 33 And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

It seems reasonable that this book can have names added and blotted out at any time. Or, one could take this verse as saying that everyone's name was written in at the foundation of the world, but as they sin, they are blotted out.

Todd

Post by **_Paidion** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 6:55 pm

Thanks, Suzana. I was going to suggest something similar, but you beat me to the punch!