Did God Approve of Polygamy?

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Paidion
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Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by Paidion » Fri May 27, 2016 6:29 pm

I have always thought that God merely tolerated polygamy in the days of ancient Israel, but that He actually wanted monogamy. But today, I came across a passage that suggests otherwise. According to Nathan's prophecy to David, the God of Israel actually gave to David his master's house and his master's wives.

Nathan said to David, “You are the man! Thus says the LORD, the God of Israel, ‘I anointed you king over Israel, and I delivered you out of the hand of Saul. And I gave you your master’s house and your master’s wives into your arms and gave you the house of Israel and of Judah. And if this were too little, I would add to you as much more. Why have you despised the word of the LORD, to do what is evil in his sight? You have struck down Uriah the Hittite with the sword and have taken his wife to be your wife and have killed him with the sword of the Ammonites. (2 Samuel 12: 7-9 ESV)

It seems that according to David, God strongly objected to David having Uriah killed so that he could take Uriah's wife, but seemingly He had no problem in giving his master's wives to him. What are your thoughts concerning this? Has something changed? Or does God still give wives to men today?
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Re: Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by crgfstr1 » Fri May 27, 2016 8:42 pm

I don't see this passage as changing your original understanding. To me it reads like, I already even allowed you to have extra wives and yet you had to go and steal your friends wife and kill him. Pointing out you were already far from where I wanted you to be and I still accepted you but now you have taken this liberty even further. So though God did give them to him it wasn't what God wanted but what David wanted and God allowed because of his faithfulness.

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Re: Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by Paidion » Fri May 27, 2016 9:01 pm

Thank you, crg, you may be right.

For God to "give David wives" may be another way of saying "God permitted David to have wives."
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Re: Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by steve7150 » Sat May 28, 2016 12:33 pm

For God to "give David wives" may be another way of saying "God permitted David to have wives."







Yes it sounds like God saying that he gave David everything Saul had yet that was not enough? The wives are just part of the mix of this transaction, not a change of God principals.

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Re: Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by Jepne » Sat May 28, 2016 5:18 pm

So though God did give them to him it wasn't what God wanted but what David wanted and God allowed because of his faithfulness.
It sounds like you are saying that, if you want more wives, God might allow it if you have been faithful?

I have seen the scripture say, I believe in Deuteronomy, that a king should have only one wife.
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Re: Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by crgfstr1 » Sun May 29, 2016 10:18 am

Jepne wrote:
So though God did give them to him it wasn't what God wanted but what David wanted and God allowed because of his faithfulness.
It sounds like you are saying that, if you want more wives, God might allow it if you have been faithful?

I have seen the scripture say, I believe in Deuteronomy, that a king should have only one wife.
Anyone "should" have only one spouse. He did allow it for David, so it seems. The way I currently look at it is the following but would like guidance where it is in error:

Everything is a gift from God. The things that God wants us to have he gives us directly. The things we want to have but he doesn't he allows Satan to give us sometimes. These things are sin or the result of sinful desires. They are bad for us in that they have negative consequences in our lives. If we are faithful then they teach us why we should have listened to God in the first place. Both the good gifts and the "bad" gifts are intended to draw the faithful nearer to God.

Having multiple spouses may sound like something desirable on the surface. Anyone who did so would almost surely miss out on having a true loving relationship that can only come between a married couple. David found that even though he had multiple wives he still lacked something that only a loving wife could provide. So he kept trying to find it.

There are two ways in which we can learn what is right or wrong. Listen to God and follow what he says. We will see wonderful results in peace and joy when we do this. Or we can not listen to God and suffer the consequences. The things we lust for are not good for us and if we get them we will learn this is so. If we are paying attention to God he will make the connection for us. See I told you so. If not we will keep seeking through other sinful activity.

I heard a statistic that compared the happiness of two groups of people 1 year after a major event. The first group were those that had won the lottery. The second group was those who had suffered the amputation of a limb. The second group was happier 1 year later.

Our culture idolizes the rich and famous. This seems so odd to me. They follow many sinful desires and their lives are a complete disaster in painful consequences. That seems an obvious lesson in where sin leads. It doesn't need to be so extreme though.

The ideal scenario is 100% of our desire should be our close relationship with God. He will give us much joy and peace. We will want for nothing. This is why I wonder if it is good to pray for anything other than a closer relationship with him. At a bare minimum if I pray for anything else I should always add if that is your will not mine. Otherwise I might get it and find out it wasn't something that made me happy or better off in anyway. If I simply stick to give me what you want me to have God I will get the best gifts.

Many lessons explain this. Israel wanted a king. God didn't want them to have one. They kept asking though so he gave them one and they suffered the consequences.

Now if only putting that in practice was as simple as understanding it.

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Re: Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by morbo3000 » Mon May 30, 2016 11:38 pm

Polygamy and Levirate marriage were God's social welfare programs. In societies where the male-female ratio is disproportionate, women and children cannot take care of themselves. So if a husband or father dies in a war, and leaves behind a wife and children they would be impoverished if another man didn't take them in.

At the king level, wives were often take to seal the deal of treaties with other nations. David and Solomon didn't need more wives than one. Which is why the law limited the number of wives a king could take.

None of this translates to the church or western civilization. True followers of Jesus take care of widows and orphans as a matter of course, without a man needing to obligate them as spouses. And a single woman can take a job for herself and not rely on a man to provide for her.

However, the Bible does not forbid polygamy. Wisdom sure does though. "One wife is trouble enough." And women would certainly say "One husband is trouble enough."

If I remember correctly, the American laws forbidding polygamy were actually religious persecution against Mormons. Who have themselves realized that one spouse is trouble enough.
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Re: Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by crgfstr1 » Tue May 31, 2016 8:30 am

I believe it was societies social welfare program not God's. Jesus established what God had intended.

How can this be said of more than one spouse?

Mathew 19: 4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,  5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?  6Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

If the man takes a second wife or the wife takes a second husband are the all 3 now one? Which wife will the husband cleave to?

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Re: Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by morbo3000 » Tue May 31, 2016 3:08 pm

I believe it was societies social welfare program not God's. Jesus established what God had intended.
How can you know that? We are trying to look back at civilization 4000+ years ago. You are doing so through the lens of Jesus 2000 years ago. Jesus lived in a very specific time, so his teachings have context that cannot be so easily ripped out of wholesale and dropped into 2016. Also, his words in this passage are descriptive, and inside a specific context. Not prescriptive, nor broad.
If the man takes a second wife or the wife takes a second husband are the all 3 now one?
Why wouldn't they? Even if you could make a case against it, it would be an inductive conclusion, and not deductive. And we have no obligation to inductive laws. That's the error of the oral law.

On the other hand, as I've said, inductive reasoning would likely conclude that while there may be no scriptural law against polygamy, it is likely unwise. Jesus and Paul would probably counsel a young man to marry one person. That's not the same as a command. And in fact, Paul seemed to favor celibacy. But that's not a command either.

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Re: Did God Approve of Polygamy?

Post by crgfstr1 » Tue May 31, 2016 5:45 pm

So if a man marries two wives and the 3 are now one. What happens when the husband dies but the two women remain alive? Are they still one? If not how were the one when the man was alive but not once he dies? If they aren't one then one could argue that the 3 were never one in the first place. That would mean the the husband and the first wife were one. The husband and the second wife were one but the 3 were not one. If that is the case then how can someone be one with two people.

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