The Narrow Path Ministries

Heb 8:7-13
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

I find this passage about the new convenant most interesting - especially verse 11. Here it says that there will no longer be a need to teach about the Lord, "for all shall know me,.."

Is this referring to a time yet to happen? Today we find that most people have a great need to be taught about the Lord. In fact, aren't we supposed to be spreading the truth of the Gospel to the world today? When is this time that ALL shall know the Lord?

Notice the next verse says, "For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more. Does this apply to the same "all" in the previous verse?

Todd

I take the House of Israel, and this passage, as a reference to the ekklesia.

I take it as after the New Jerusalem has come down and God dwells among us so that there is no longer any night and the gates are always open and the Spirit and bride invite whosoever to drink the water of life.

I believe it refers to the time we live in now. "They shall all know me" refers to a one-on-one relationship with God. We don't need a man as mediator between us and God anymore, we can go directly into His presence. In the old coveanant only the preists could go before God and offer sacrifices. They were also the ones who taught the law.

In the new covenant we are the preiests, we offer the "sacrifices" and we can now mediate for non-believers by prayer.

Also, and maybe more to the point, we are taught directly by the Holy Spirit to love one another, something that was not done in the old covanent as far as I know.

I would cite John and Paul as stating such:

1 John 2:27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him.

1 Thessalonians 4:9
Now as to the love of the brethren, you have no need for anyone to write to you, for you yourselves are taught by God to love one another;

Titus 2:11-12 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. It teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age

I think this is what is meant by the Hebrews 8 new covenant passage you quoted, were the Holy Spirit is given and teaches us to love one another. Paul could on the one hand say he doesn't need to teach or write anything about this because we are taught by God, and on the other hand Paul taught many things.

Sean,

So then, to whom does the "all" in verse 11 refer? According to the previous statement that would be "every man his neighbor and every man his brother." Your reply seems to indicate that the "all" refers to all christians. If this is true then I will agree with you. However, if the "all" refers to all flesh, then it means something else. Who then is your neighbor? Are all your neighbors christians?

Todd

Todd, if you go to Steve's "the Fall of Jerusalem - Part 1" you will get your answer about 10 minutes into the lecture. Here is the direct link to the recording. http://www.thenarrowpath.com/mp3s/top/top09.mp3

Allyn wrote:Todd, if you go to Steve's "the Fall of Jerusalem - Part 1" you will get your answer about 10 minutes into the lecture. Here is the direct link to the recording. http://www.thenarrowpath.com/mp3s/top/top09.mp3

Allyn,

I am not disputing when the first covenant was replaced by the second. I just think that the wording of verse 11 could be explaining that one result of this new convenant is a time when all flesh will know the Lord, as described in Phil 2:9-11 and Rev 5:13.

Todd

Just a quick reply for you Todd. Steve teaches that under the old covenant the people only had the priest to teach them the ways. This ceased once the gospel came into effect under the New Covenant. We all now equally have access to the teachings of the Gospel not only through the word, but through the Holy Spirit.

Allyn wrote:Just a quick reply for you Todd. Steve teaches that under the old covenant the people only had the priest to teach them the ways. This ceased once the gospel came into effect under the New Covenant. We all now equally have access to the teachings of the Gospel not only through the word, but through the Holy Spirit.

Allyn,

You and Sean and Steve could very well be correct. If so, then the "all" in verse 11 is referring to "all christians." If you try to reconcile the verse with the orthodox veiw then it could mean nothing else. If however, someone were to espouse universalism, he could easily take it to mean "all flesh."

Todd

Father_of_five wrote:

Allyn wrote:Just a quick reply for you Todd. Steve teaches that under the old covenant the people only had the priest to teach them the ways. This ceased once the gospel came into effect under the New Covenant. We all now equally have access to the teachings of the Gospel not only through the word, but through the Holy Spirit.

Allyn,

You and Sean and Steve could very well be correct. If so, then the "all" in verse 11 is referring to "all christians." If you try to reconcile the verse with the orthodox veiw then it could mean nothing else. If however, someone were to espouse universalism, he could easily take it to mean "all flesh."

Todd

Why would God give any warning or interact in any way with us while in the flesh if the "true" salvation comes to all after death?

Why is there a condition of repentance from dead works and a renewal by the Spirit if salvation comes to all?

To be honest, annihilation makes more sense.

All are reconciled but there is a condition to this. Faith, not like the demons who believe and shudder, but a true faith.

I believe God does it this way to test you. There is no better way to test someones love than to put them in a place of temptation and then offer them a way out that requires denial of the world around them and an obidience to and invisible God.

That's why those who know the truth, but would rather live it up now in denial only store up God's wrath against them.

This is a passage that comes to mind:
2Th 1:5 This is evidence of the righteous judgment of God, that you may be considered worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you are also suffering--
2Th 1:6 since indeed God considers it just to repay with affliction those who afflict you,
2Th 1:7 and to grant relief to you who are afflicted as well as to us, when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with his mighty angels
2Th 1:8 in flaming fire, inflicting vengeance on those who do not know God and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.
2Th 1:9 They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might,
2Th 1:10 when he comes on that day to be glorified in his saints, and to be marveled at among all who have believed, because our testimony to you was believed.

It seems that there is a seperation of believers and unbelievers. You can point to the passage that says 'every knee will bow and every tongue will confess'. I agree, this is after death/at the resurrection. The unbelievers will confess the truth, but that doesn't make them a true believer any more than a demon is a believer just by confessing Jesus. There is a difference. I can convince someone that Jesus died for the sins of all, but even if they believe it as a historical fact, they still have to be born again. So people are going to admit the truth on the day of judgement, but if God let them go, they would just go back to sinning again, because that is their desire. Someone who is saved still does commit sin, but it pains them and they look foreward to relief. An unsaved person doesn't want God under any circumstances. Think about it, God has offered His Son as payment, and people trample it, because they don't want it. I believe this is the way God proves who honestly love Him.