I've heard Steve speak on this often - a friend is preparing a sermon on the subject and asking for resources -- is there a lecture or post here that addresses that head on which I can share with him ?
(or a book by another that shares the view he promotes?)
Biblical Worldview vs. Capitalism/Nationalism etc.
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darinhouston
- Posts: 3123
- Joined: Tue Aug 26, 2008 7:45 am
Re: Biblical Worldview vs. Capitalism/Nationalism etc.
I think that capitalism is compatible with biblical values and ethics, but I do not see any biblical basis for nationalism.
I take "capitalism" to mean, simply, the "free market," where people are allowed to invest their money in business and control their legitimate gains. I consider this to simply be in contrast to someone else (e.g., the government, or some armed thug) telling a man what he must do with his honest earnings. Unfortunately, capitalism has become associated, in the popular mind, with heartless profiteering and greed. Of course, the Bible would not support that.
When evaluating capitalism, we are considering the question of how principles of justice are applied to political, economic and public policy. It has to do with how we believe every man's rights should be preserved, be he Christian or non-Christian. Obviously, a Christian man has his own set of obligations with respect to the acquisition, stewardship and dispersal of his property. As a member of an alternative society, he observes an alternative economy in which he owns nothing, but is stewarding God's property.
However, this does not mean that he cannot, while observing his own Christian ethic of economics, still participate in a capitalistic system. In fact, it is capitalism (in contrast to socialism or communism) that afford the Christian the greatest freedom to steward God's property freely according to his own conscience. This is desirable.
I understand "nationalism" to mean a special loyalty to one's own nation or nationality. To me, this is as ethically silly as is loyalty to a school, a sports team, a gender, or a race for no better reason than that it is one's own school, team, gender or race. The Bible says that God is not a respecter of persons, in the context of which it means that God evaluates people on their merits, rather than on the basis of their race, country of origin, gender, etc.
I take "capitalism" to mean, simply, the "free market," where people are allowed to invest their money in business and control their legitimate gains. I consider this to simply be in contrast to someone else (e.g., the government, or some armed thug) telling a man what he must do with his honest earnings. Unfortunately, capitalism has become associated, in the popular mind, with heartless profiteering and greed. Of course, the Bible would not support that.
When evaluating capitalism, we are considering the question of how principles of justice are applied to political, economic and public policy. It has to do with how we believe every man's rights should be preserved, be he Christian or non-Christian. Obviously, a Christian man has his own set of obligations with respect to the acquisition, stewardship and dispersal of his property. As a member of an alternative society, he observes an alternative economy in which he owns nothing, but is stewarding God's property.
However, this does not mean that he cannot, while observing his own Christian ethic of economics, still participate in a capitalistic system. In fact, it is capitalism (in contrast to socialism or communism) that afford the Christian the greatest freedom to steward God's property freely according to his own conscience. This is desirable.
I understand "nationalism" to mean a special loyalty to one's own nation or nationality. To me, this is as ethically silly as is loyalty to a school, a sports team, a gender, or a race for no better reason than that it is one's own school, team, gender or race. The Bible says that God is not a respecter of persons, in the context of which it means that God evaluates people on their merits, rather than on the basis of their race, country of origin, gender, etc.
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thrombomodulin
- Posts: 431
- Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2008 6:59 am
Re: Biblical Worldview vs. Capitalism/Nationalism etc.
Darin,
I've discussed this topic at some length with stevef under 'radio program topics', 'health care insurance'. For sure the right starting point is defining property rights and how they are attained. For this, I would recommend John Locke's second treatise on civil government. He deals at length the allocation of previously unowned property, and defends the idea that no man has a rightful claim over the property (or labor) of another man (i.e. a man's property begins with his body, and extends to that which "he mixes his labor with"). The ideas of socialism and communism reject the notion of individual ownership of property, and introduce the idea that one person has ownership over the fruit of the labor of another. I am of the opinion that the biblical concepts of "do not covet" and "do not steal", preclude socialism and communism. Someone may perhaps argue that Caesar (or the "majority") is not bound to such rules, however, this introduces the question of whether Caesars authority is absolutely unlimited, or limited to those functions which God has appointed for him to carry out (e.g. Rom 13).
There are several subtopics which are significant:
1) An understanding of value - which is addressed to some extent in the post above. This is very important because it is the key thing the classic economics got wrong. Karl Marx recognized the problem of their value theory, but failed to identify the correct solution - hence his communist view. The correct view being that in exchange each participant in the transaction values the same items differently, namely each values what he receives more than what he parts with. Thus, there is no "residual" unaccounted as per Karl Marx, upon which he based his ideas - see Wage Labor and Capital.
2) An understanding of the money, in particular ethical considerations in the production of money, (I never got through addressing this with SteveF)
3) An understanding of what can rightfully be considered property, and what cannot.
My time is up for now, hope this is helpful.
Pete
I recommend the following:
Jorg Guide Hullsman, "The Ethics of Money Production".
http://mises.org/etexts/propertyexploitation.pdf
http://mises.org/journals/qjae/pdf/qjae7_4_4.pdf
http://www.garynorth.com
Bastiat - "The Law."
I've discussed this topic at some length with stevef under 'radio program topics', 'health care insurance'. For sure the right starting point is defining property rights and how they are attained. For this, I would recommend John Locke's second treatise on civil government. He deals at length the allocation of previously unowned property, and defends the idea that no man has a rightful claim over the property (or labor) of another man (i.e. a man's property begins with his body, and extends to that which "he mixes his labor with"). The ideas of socialism and communism reject the notion of individual ownership of property, and introduce the idea that one person has ownership over the fruit of the labor of another. I am of the opinion that the biblical concepts of "do not covet" and "do not steal", preclude socialism and communism. Someone may perhaps argue that Caesar (or the "majority") is not bound to such rules, however, this introduces the question of whether Caesars authority is absolutely unlimited, or limited to those functions which God has appointed for him to carry out (e.g. Rom 13).
There are several subtopics which are significant:
1) An understanding of value - which is addressed to some extent in the post above. This is very important because it is the key thing the classic economics got wrong. Karl Marx recognized the problem of their value theory, but failed to identify the correct solution - hence his communist view. The correct view being that in exchange each participant in the transaction values the same items differently, namely each values what he receives more than what he parts with. Thus, there is no "residual" unaccounted as per Karl Marx, upon which he based his ideas - see Wage Labor and Capital.
2) An understanding of the money, in particular ethical considerations in the production of money, (I never got through addressing this with SteveF)
3) An understanding of what can rightfully be considered property, and what cannot.
My time is up for now, hope this is helpful.
Pete
I recommend the following:
Jorg Guide Hullsman, "The Ethics of Money Production".
http://mises.org/etexts/propertyexploitation.pdf
http://mises.org/journals/qjae/pdf/qjae7_4_4.pdf
http://www.garynorth.com
Bastiat - "The Law."