Studying the gospel of Luke right now. In it, Yeshua forgives people's sins by spoken word. If Yeshua could just say "you are forgiven" by the power of his word and it was done, then what was the point of the cross? Instead of dying once for all, why not speak once for all? But it opens up even more questions...
The wages of sin is death. A whole sacrifical system was initiated by Yahweh because of this. Blood atonement was part of Torah. Is Yeshua breaking Torah? Does he nullify Yahweh's command by forgiving with his word and without sacrifice? The woman that washed Yeshua's feet was repentant. There is no indication that many of the ones that came to be healed were repentant when Yeshua forgave their sins. The common thread is the faith they had--they believed Yahweh indwelled and was working through Yeshua, that Yeshua was Yahweh's mouthpiece and instrument of Israel's restoration.
I wonder if there's a difference between intentional and unintentional sin and whether that might mean death or not. In any case, I struggle on with Luke.
One other obseravtion...Yeshua clearly portarys himself as a prophet in Luke in word and deed, but not once (at least in my study thus far) has he ever said "so says Yahweh" the major prophetic indicator. Interesting...
forgiveness of sins by word
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forgiveness of sins by word
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Reason:
Dave,
I understand the authority of Christ to forgive sins prior to His atoning death to be the same as God’s authority to forgive sins in the Old Testament, which was also before Christ's death. I am of the opinion that every sin forgiven prior to the crucifixion of Christ was forgiven on the basis of the anticipated atonement made at Calvary.
Some may feel that, in the Old Testament, sins were forgiven on the basis of the temple sacrifices, but David knew better. He should have been executed for his adultery and murder in the case of Uriah’s wife, but upon his mere repentance, Nathan announced that God forgave David. In writing about this later, David spoke of the joy of being one “whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered…to whom the Lord does not impute iniquity” (Ps.32:1-2). David acknowledged that animal sacrifices played no part in his being forgiven, and that the only sacrifice that he had offered to God was “a broken and contrite heart” (Ps.51:16-17). The writer of Hebrews confirms that “it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins” (10:4). The animal sacrifices were merely a symbolic ritual practiced to foreshadow Christ's death (Heb.9:9).
God already knew, before Christ died, that He would do so for the sins of the world, and, in Old Testament times, God was willing to grant forgiveness to the repentant and the believing “on credit”…later to be paid for by Christ at the cross. This is what I understand to be Paul’s meaning when he says that God set forth Christ to be a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate that God was justified in “passing over” the sins of Old Testament believers (Romans 3:25).
There is no record of Jesus ever declaring a blanket forgiveness of all sins to anyone whom we know certainly to have been an unbeliever. You mentioned the woman (who was clearly repentant and “loved much”—Luke 7:47-48), and there is also the paralytic to whom Jesus (“when he saw their faith”) proclaimed, “Man, your sins are forgiven you” (Luke 5:20).
Jesus probably never prefaced His remarks with the typical prophetic “Thus says Yahweh…” because He prefaced them with the equivalent, “Verily, verily, I say to you…” Unlike the prophets, Jesus could speak AS Yahweh, not just FOR Yahweh.
I understand the authority of Christ to forgive sins prior to His atoning death to be the same as God’s authority to forgive sins in the Old Testament, which was also before Christ's death. I am of the opinion that every sin forgiven prior to the crucifixion of Christ was forgiven on the basis of the anticipated atonement made at Calvary.
Some may feel that, in the Old Testament, sins were forgiven on the basis of the temple sacrifices, but David knew better. He should have been executed for his adultery and murder in the case of Uriah’s wife, but upon his mere repentance, Nathan announced that God forgave David. In writing about this later, David spoke of the joy of being one “whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered…to whom the Lord does not impute iniquity” (Ps.32:1-2). David acknowledged that animal sacrifices played no part in his being forgiven, and that the only sacrifice that he had offered to God was “a broken and contrite heart” (Ps.51:16-17). The writer of Hebrews confirms that “it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins” (10:4). The animal sacrifices were merely a symbolic ritual practiced to foreshadow Christ's death (Heb.9:9).
God already knew, before Christ died, that He would do so for the sins of the world, and, in Old Testament times, God was willing to grant forgiveness to the repentant and the believing “on credit”…later to be paid for by Christ at the cross. This is what I understand to be Paul’s meaning when he says that God set forth Christ to be a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate that God was justified in “passing over” the sins of Old Testament believers (Romans 3:25).
There is no record of Jesus ever declaring a blanket forgiveness of all sins to anyone whom we know certainly to have been an unbeliever. You mentioned the woman (who was clearly repentant and “loved much”—Luke 7:47-48), and there is also the paralytic to whom Jesus (“when he saw their faith”) proclaimed, “Man, your sins are forgiven you” (Luke 5:20).
Jesus probably never prefaced His remarks with the typical prophetic “Thus says Yahweh…” because He prefaced them with the equivalent, “Verily, verily, I say to you…” Unlike the prophets, Jesus could speak AS Yahweh, not just FOR Yahweh.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Reason:
In Jesus,
Steve
Steve