God's Promises and His Imminent Return

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_Homer
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Post by _Homer » Wed Apr 12, 2006 12:57 am

I'm just waiting anxiously for the first pastor to tell his congregation that God has told him all the money is going outside of the building and salary - feeding, clothing, helping pay the bills of folks who are struggling both inside and outside the body of Christ. "God has told me that all of our giving needs to go directly to the aid of people."
I don't think God says stuff like that! Surely we would have heard of a case by now if He does. :D
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_JD
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Post by _JD » Wed Apr 12, 2006 1:08 am

Homer, very funny.

That reminded me, Jesus tried it once, and it didn't go over well. Jesus said to him, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell what you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me." But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful, for he had great possessions. Matthew 19:21-22

The Lord must figure if a pagan won't give up his stuff, why even broach the subject with a pastor. 8)

JD
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_AARONDISNEY
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Post by _AARONDISNEY » Wed Apr 12, 2006 5:07 am

Hey guys,
Guess that wasn't my last post. Here's the thing. I understand your concern that the Churches in this country and in many places are mainly concerned with things that are material and not about the things God spoke of. That is a fact.
However that does not describe my Church. We are interested in reaching people. We are a Church with a heart.
I guess I got all crazy with it and forgot for a sec that JD and everyone on here does not know my pastor nor our congregation to know that. I think we have a Church that is after God's heart. Not flawless by any means but going in the right direction.
There is no question in my mind God wants us to build. Sorry again for getting frustrated. Thing is if one of you told me that God had spoken to your Church to do such and such and it was not in opposition to His WOrd I'd at least give you the benefit of the doubt in order to get to the heart of the conversation. And this has gone so very far from it's original intention.
Thanks for the responses (I suppose :? :wink: )
Aaron
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_livingink
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Post by _livingink » Thu Apr 13, 2006 9:11 pm

Hello AARONDISNEY,

I have a friend who made a gospel tape of his singing because he said "God laid it on my heart to do this". You used somewhat the same terminology when you said the building program was put on your pastor's heart. Do you know if that's another way of saying that the Spirit led them to do these things? I'm still looking at scripture to see if something fits re: the second part of your question any moreso that what Allyn and JD already said.

livingink
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_Homer
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Post by _Homer » Thu Apr 13, 2006 10:15 pm

How do you determine if God has told you something or it is your (or several people's) mental impression? I have seen, many times, several people who strongly believe a church should pursue one course of action, while others are just as convinced another course should be followed. Who is God speaking to? Both? Neither?

In Genesis 15, Abraham, our example of faith, receives a promise from God in v.7 and then promptly asks God, v.8, "how shall I know" if it will happen and God responded with a sign that removed Abraham's uncertainity.

Sould we do as Abraham did when we think "God spoke this to my heart"?
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_David
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Post by _David » Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:42 pm

Homer,
There is a book that my wife and I have partially read called "Decision Making and the Will of God". Unfortunately, I cannot find the book at this time to tell you the author's name because we are packing in preparation for a cross-country move. However, so far I have been impressed with what I have read and it has challenged my thinking on the Biblical information concerning how a Christian should approach decision making.
I spent my early years as a Christian in college at a charismatic church where many people spoke of "hearing the Lord's voice" or "being told by the Lord.." or having the Lord put things on their heart. This is something that I feel I have experienced at times in my life, though I quickly learned even as a young believer to not believe "every spirit" because even well meaning believers sometimes (apparently) heard incorrectly!
In my opinion, and this is based on my experience as a believer, as I have grown in my understanding of the Scripture I have needed to "hear" from the Lord less frequently. That may sound counterintuitive, or it may make me sound as if I have grown apart from the Lord, but I think much of it has to do with just growing up. I now have fewer questions about what is right and wrong and have gained insights into application of Scripture such that decisions that seemed difficult earlier in my spiritual life now seem more black and white. What's more, I now feel a certain liberty as a growing Christian to make some decisions without as much waiting on a prompting, because my theology has grown to include the sovereignty of God in affecting the outcome. I find that when faced with decisions that are not moral in nature (for example, how I chose my new job in a different state), I did pray that God would lead me in any way He deemed necesary and I trusted Him to sovereignly control the factors outside my control to lead me in the right path. However, when faced with a decision with no moral high ground, I made the wisest decision I knew how to while praying for God's leadership. In the past, I would have probably waited for a "leading" or a "word", which at times stymied my decision making because no word was forthcoming.
I am a parent, and I hope that my children will always be willing to ask my opinion when they need advice (and of course, I pray that my counsel will be godly). As they age, however, they should need my counsel less and less if I have done an adequate job of teaching them the Scripture. That is not to say that they will have all of the answers, just like I don't, but with maturity comes the peace of knowing that what God has said in His Word need not be repeated with a confirmation. And in the areas where there is no clear specific answers in the Scripture, which is not as common as people assume, then one of several options may be equally pleasing to the Lord. To trust the Lord in that case may mean making a decision and trusting God with the results.
I believe people would ask for a word less if they knew the Word more. That has been the experience of many believers, not just myself, and comes from a better understanding of how to apply Scripture. Additionally, though I do believe God can communicate to a person extra-Biblically, it is often difficult to know how to test such a word. For most of us, these words are not prophecies as much as feelings about which decision to make. Often, these decisions do not give one outcome that is so much better than another, and therefore it can be impossible to know if we really heard from the Lord or just thought we did. As we mature, we learn to discern the voice of the Shepherd more accurately, but I think much of that communication is channeled through the Scripture. As this forum shows, even Scripture can be debated and contested in terms of its meaning, but at least in that case we know "all Scripture is God breathed" which is more than I can say for some of the dreams and words I have been told of.
Lastly, I do not look down on any believer who tells me that the Lord told them something. I do, however, reserve a more jaundiced eye towards any statement that is out of step with the Scripture, is untestable, or lacks the fruit that the Spirit bears when at work.
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David

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