Satan Loosed for a Little While

[_Derek]

But the loosening does not occur until the 1000 years are finished. How could we possibly be in that time now?

I think that the devil is currently bound from "deceiving the nations". He was free to do this before the cross (where he was bound). The whole world before the cross was in utter darkness (aside from the Jews).

The thousand years is symbolic of the church age (where we "reign with Christ").

Before His second coming. The devil will be again loosed to deceive the nations. But only for a "little while", before he is destroyed.

Then there is judgement, and all those whose names are not found in the book of life will be cast into the lake of fire.

God bless,

[Guest]

Steve's two lectures on Revelation 20 are the most comprehensive treatment of the chapter I have ever heard. (I found it interesting that Steve and I are ex-dispensationalists...and it was the exact same texts that convinced us (both) otherwise, in my case, back around 1979).

Click Verse by Verse Teachings, then Revelation, lectures 14 & 15

Even if you aren't convinced of the Amillennial view, (but how could you not be? lol, huh, Derek?), it's a great Bible study!
Rick

P.S. Derek...was the devil an angel, maybe, or some kind of reptile? Wait...was he a snake or a dragon? or both? and are dragons real? jk Bro

Don't miss Steve's lectures if yer really interested, imo, folks!

[Guest]

But the loosening does not occur until the 1000 years are finished. How could we possibly be in that time now?


Good observation and the wording is a little unclear but apparently the loosing of Satan is still before Christ's second coming because i think the fire that came down from heaven to consume them is symbolic of His second coming. Rev 20.9

[mgarrett]

Before His second coming. The devil will be again loosed to deceive the nations. But only for a "little while", before he is destroyed.

This is where it begins to not make sense for me. I can follow the logic of Satan being bound (or limited) when the Gospel was revealed through Christ, but how can that be undone? This seems to be the logical conclusion of this line of thinking. How can the truth of the Gospel be taken away at some point?

It says that Satan was bound so that "He could decieve the nations no more" and when Satan is loosed he goes out "to deceive the nations." So, what is actually happening here? Do all the Bibles and books written about the Bible get destroyed, and proclaimers of the Gospel get wiped out? This seems very unlikely.

Todd

[mgarrett]

I think your "explanation" is a total spiritualizing of scripture so that the words no longer have their intended meaning

Paidion,

I think that it is perfectly logical to interpret Rev 20 spiritually. There are many scriptures in the New Testament that describe those who are in Christ as "alive in Christ" and those who are lost as "dead." These are spiritual descriptions. Here are a few examples.

Eph 2:1
And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins,

John 5:25
Most assuredly, I say to you, the hour is coming, and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God; and those who hear will live.

Col 2:13
And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses,

1 Tim 5:6
But she who lives in pleasure is dead while she lives.

So, as I see it, those who are dead in Rev 20 are spiritually dead, and those who are living are alive in Christ.

Todd

[Guest]

to deceive the nations." So, what is actually happening here? Do all the Bibles and books written about the Bible get destroyed, and proclaimers of the Gospel get wiped out? This seems very unlikely.

No biblical information isn't destroyed but the attempt to discredit it increases like never before. Thus IMHO the nations being deceived are Islamic and secular nations like the ones in Eorope.

[_Derek]

This is where it begins to not make sense for me. I can follow the logic of Satan being bound (or limited) when the Gospel was revealed through Christ, but how can that be undone? This seems to be the logical conclusion of this line of thinking. How can the truth of the Gospel be taken away at some point?

It says that Satan was bound so that "He could decieve the nations no more" and when Satan is loosed he goes out "to deceive the nations." So, what is actually happening here? Do all the Bibles and books written about the Bible get destroyed, and proclaimers of the Gospel get wiped out? This seems very unlikely.

Hi Todd,

Well, the devil will be loosed, and apparently God will let him deceive the nations again, even though the gospel is here. It could very well be that they are deceived as to the truth content in "all the Bibles and books written about the Bible". There are millions of people right here in America that feel this way now.

But again, let's keep in mind that it only says "a little while" which could mean any length of time.

At the end of the 1000 years (their lifetime) Satan is "loosed," which simply refers to the physical death of the follower of Christ. But this loosing of Satan only lasts for "a little while" because at Christ's return all are resurrected.

The passage states what the devil is loosed for. "To deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth". How do you get "the physical death of the follower of Christ", from "deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth"?

The "rest of the dead" don't live again until the 1000 years are finished. This simply means that if they are not followers of Christ during their lifetime they are spiritually dead and will not "live" until the resurrection at Christ's return. Instead, while they are spiritually dead during their lifetime on this earth, they are "cast into the LOF" which refers to the endless conviction of the Holy Spirit at work in their hearts

"The rest of the dead" are unbelievers for sure. However, this is physical death that is in view. This is evidenced by the preceding verse, which speaks of "the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus...". Vs. 5 meantions "the rest of the dead" in contrast to the dead people in vs. 4. Physical death. Surely you don't spiritualize "beheaded for the witness of Jesus" do you?

This is the first death. A physical phenomenon. The "second death" (vs. 14) takes place after the judgement at the end of the church age (end of the world basically). Personally, though most don't agree with me, I think the souls of these men are destroyed in the lake of fire (or at least begin to be).

I don't see where the Lake of fire is "the endless conviction of the Holy Spririt" in a persons heart. Is that how the devil is "tormented day and night for ever and ever" (vs. 10)? By being convicted by the Holy Spirit? Sorry. I dont' see it.

Being thrown into the lake of fire is after the judgement in which the dead are judged out of the book of life. This is the second death.

[mgarrett]

Hi Derek,

Well, the devil will be loosed, and apparently God will let him deceive the nations again, even though the gospel is here. It could very well be that they are deceived as to the truth content in "all the Bibles and books written about the Bible". There are millions of people right here in America that feel this way now.

The problem with this line of thinking is it assumes that darkness overcomes light, which is the exact opposite of what the Bible teaches. In this age of mass communication the truth of the Gospel is reaching corners of the earth as never before. Light overcomes darkness; therefore, that which is truth will prevail over error. With this in mind, I don't think that the "loosing of Satan to deceive the nations" is speaking of error being taught or the spreading of humanism or Islam or anything like this. For this to be the case darkness would prevail over light.

The passage states what the devil is loosed for. "To deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth". How do you get "the physical death of the follower of Christ", from "deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth"?

Just that physical death is a deception because Christ has gained victory over death and will come again and raise us up.

"The rest of the dead" are unbelievers for sure. However, this is physical death that is in view. This is evidenced by the preceding verse, which speaks of "the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus...". Vs. 5 meantions "the rest of the dead" in contrast to the dead people in vs. 4. Physical death. Surely you don't spiritualize "beheaded for the witness of Jesus" do you?

If we following this logic, and take this literally, then it only applies to those whose heads were chopped off. I suppose you could stretch it a little to include all those who were martyred, but how could this description apply to all Christians? It's a big stretch. This does not have to apply to only those Christians who are physically dead. Consider the following verse.

Matt 10:39
Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.

If you apply it this way, it must include all Christians. They were not physically dead, but they were made alive in Christ - they "lived and reigned with Christ."

This is the first death. A physical phenomenon. The "second death" (vs. 14) takes place after the judgement at the end of the church age (end of the world basically). Personally, though most don't agree with me, I think the souls of these men are destroyed in the lake of fire (or at least begin to be).

We've discussed this before. We see it differently. You say that the first death is physical and the second death happens after Christ's return. What about spiritual death? I listed several verses earlier in this thread that speak of spiritual death. Which death is that?

Todd

[_Derek]

Derek wrote:
Well, the devil will be loosed, and apparently God will let him deceive the nations again, even though the gospel is here. It could very well be that they are deceived as to the truth content in "all the Bibles and books written about the Bible". There are millions of people right here in America that feel this way now.

The problem with this line of thinking is it assumes that darkness overcomes light, which is the exact opposite of what the Bible teaches. In this age of mass communication the truth of the Gospel is reaching corners of the earth as never before. Light overcomes darkness; therefore, that which is truth will prevail over error. With this in mind, I don't think that the "loosing of Satan to deceive the nations" is speaking of error being taught or the spreading of humanism or Islam or anything like this. For this to be the case darkness would prevail over light.

Darkness doesn't overcome light. God sovereignly allows the devil to do so for a "short time".

Derek wrote:
"The rest of the dead" are unbelievers for sure. However, this is physical death that is in view. This is evidenced by the preceding verse, which speaks of "the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus...". Vs. 5 meantions "the rest of the dead" in contrast to the dead people in vs. 4. Physical death. Surely you don't spiritualize "beheaded for the witness of Jesus" do you?

If we following this logic, and take this literally, then it only applies to those whose heads were chopped off. I suppose you could stretch it a little to include all those who were martyred, but how could this description apply to all Christians? It's a big stretch. This does not have to apply to only those Christians who are physically dead. Consider the following verse.

I didn't say that I took it litterally. It is a vision. But it does symbolize something that is related to being beheaded for the Gospel.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

That this verse, is speaking only of a certain group of martyrs (early Jewish Christains), and showing how they are reigning from heaven with Jesus, does not disqualify those that are in the Kingdom of God (the chosen nation, royal preisthood, etc), on earth from reigning as well. It may just be that this verse doesn't mention that.

or....

It could also apply more generally, to all those who have gone on to heaven, prior to the ressurection. All who have not "worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands...", and died in this faithfull state, as well as martyrs.

I have never stated that I think that this verse is about those saints on earth (again, that doesn't mean that we don't somehow reign with Christ).


If I understand you correctly, you think that being "alive" is being in Christ. That would mean that those in vs.4 are in fact alive. Why then is the term "the rest of the dead" used in vs. 5? Is there in fact another kind of death besides physical and spiritual that you would apply to those people in vs. 4? That they are somehow dead, is indisputable due to the use of the phrase "the rest of the dead" in vs. 5.

There is nothing obvious to separate the kind of "dead" in vs. 5 from that in vs. 4. I know that those who have "been beheaded for the Gospel" are not spiritually dead; so what is it?

Derek wrote:
This is the first death. A physical phenomenon. The "second death" (vs. 14) takes place after the judgement at the end of the church age (end of the world basically). Personally, though most don't agree with me, I think the souls of these men are destroyed in the lake of fire (or at least begin to be).

We've discussed this before. We see it differently. You say that the first death is physical and the second death happens after Christ's return. What about spiritual death? I listed several verses earlier in this thread that speak of spiritual death. Which death is that?

Why, just because the bible meantions the state of being spiritually dead, do you have to understand every usage of the word that way?

What is the second death according to you?

God bless,

[mgarrett]

If I understand you correctly, you think that being "alive" is being in Christ. That would mean that those in vs.4 are in fact alive. Why then is the term "the rest of the dead" used in vs. 5? Is there in fact another kind of death besides physical and spiritual that you would apply to those people in vs. 4? That they are somehow dead, is indisputable due to the use of the phrase "the rest of the dead" in vs. 5.

There is nothing obvious to separate the kind of "dead" in vs. 5 from that in vs. 4. I know that those who have "been beheaded for the Gospel" are not spiritually dead; so what is it?

The answer to this is simple. Read this verse.

Col 2:13
And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses,

You see, we were all spiritually dead before being made alive in Christ. We were dead and we are resurrected spiritually. We "have part" in Christ's (the first) resurrection through the new birth. The "rest of the dead" do not experience this spiritual resurrection because they do not become followers of Christ; therefore, they do not live again until the 1000 years are finished.

What is the second death according to you?

I gave my view of this in the first post. It is the unending conviction and condemnation of the Holy Spirit visited upon the "rest of the dead" as a call to repentence.

Notice the wording, it says, "I saw the dead standing before the thone." First of all, if the physical resurrection had already occured, they wouldn't still be dead. These are spiritually dead. Their judgment is going on right now. That's how I see it.

Todd