Question For Show: Safeguarding Against Activists?

[jpat1975]

Question for Steve:

Now that the laws are changing even more on various things the bible speaks against (as per the recent Supreme Court rulings), it seems obvious enough to me that activists pushing to legalize all forms of immorality will not stop. I believe this is all part of a big push to persecute Christians. I predict we'll see the churches being forced underground similar to what we see in the middle east and china. Based on your understanding of history, and those more recent areas of the world where Christians are underground - what is the best way to prepare for that?

Some things all organized Christian groups should be doing now
- Transitioning away from dependence on a tax-exempt status, one day you won't have it
- STOP all civil/legal portions of the wedding stuff, and just have a service to blessing newly weds who are ESTABLISHED members of that local group.
- Delegating more and more responsibility to lay members and preparing them for meeting in homes. The big leaders are going to be targets, and it's foolish to rely on one guy at the front. It was never like that originally.
- Studying the laws to find ways to meet privately while respecting the city's bylaws (parking, etc), staying one step ahead of the activists. People meeting privately and informally as friends and family will never be illegal.
- etc

I see "house church" as the future of the church here in North America. No amount of Republicans or any right-leaning group in power is going to correct this situation. It may slow things down, and provide some respite.

Honestly I see coming persecution of big groups as a painful but healthy thing, and will help separate the true from the phoney Christians.

Is it wrong for me to say that?

What strategies to adjust to this new reality can we begin right now?

What steps can we take now to adjust things to be safe from activists and those looking to get Christians into legal problems?

One idea I had is churches should focus on preaching of what God approves of and pointing out all the good that comes of doing things God's way. And give brief mention to how there's only problems and loss of blessing outside of God's pattern. Never name "gay marriage" and go bashing it, but rather remind over and over marriages that we see pleasing God. Give mention to how the world is "getting worse, and the problems it experiences are no surprise to those who follow God's way of doing things". Dropping hints in public, while saying the more controversial truth off-line in private conversations.

Any other ideas?

[steve]

Hi jpat,

I see things very similarly to you—and have seen them that way for decades, but more-or-less privately. It sounds like you may have a calling as a strategist! We need people who can think through such logistical issues. Christians can operate underground, as necessary, though leaders and spokesment will always be targets. I have believed this since I was 16, reading books by Richard Wurmbrandt, Brother Andrew, Harlan Popov, Coorie ten Boom, and other Christians who, in modern times have gone through oppressive persecutions. I suspect that Christians who, until now, have been lukewarm, definitely need to count the cost of discipleship, and get all in or all out. Learning to trust in God and to live on the grace of God are no longer going to be optional luxuries.

[jpat1975]

Would it be possible to record your thoughts on persecution and practical steps for Christians operating in hostile territory. I could see you doing a series on that. Looking at relevant scriptures and working in examples from church history and parallel that with today.

Pretty sure you have plenty on your plate already but I really feel you should tackle this subject sooner than later to help equip others for what is coming.

A couple of your callers have asked you on this subject recently and maybe a good starting point might be to edit together your radio answers from the last couple days.

Sorting through the archives is not the easiest when tracking down your great answers and these really need to reach a wider audience.

I also see a culture war mentality among many Christians and fear this also instills in us a lack of love and compassion for those who do not know Jesus.

I have a lot of peace about this and fear many Christians making a big noise about losing the culture war are losing sight of this.

Much easier to point the finger at the heathen than to ourselves
"...will they resist? And what would it say about them if they simply bow to the high courts ruling...? If not, will they begin to recognize the inconsistency between resisting in this case and bowing to court rulings about dissolution of marriages in the past and present? ... If so, will they recognize... That they are permitting a secular government to decide what an institution as sacred as marriage means for them? ... American conservative (traditional) Christianity is at a crossroads; this is a crisis. It wouldnt be if they had before disentangled their theology of marriage (including divorce) from government decisions, if they had recognized that America is NOT a Christian nation and that true Christianity is always, everywhere, a counter cultural remnant, a group of resident aliens, a colony of Gods people NOT connected to any state or government..."

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/rogereolso ... s-must-do/

[steve]

Perhaps I will prepare and teach on the subject of persecution and our preparation for it. I had a lecture recorded in the 80s about "Martyrdom" (advocating it as a worthy Christian option, of course!), though I don't know what became of the recording. It was not a common subject for Christians in America to be examining, at the time, though there have been a number of books in more recent years focusing on the subject of worldwide Christian martyrdom. Certain subjects are very common in scripture, but seldom thought relevant to American Christianity. I have always believed and taught that this may change in our lifetimes.

[Jason]

This is a question that a lot of us have. How do we live in a post-Christian world? Some have a bent toward optimism and I see the Supreme Court ruling as a positive thing for the Kingdom of God. I say this because for the past decade, this non-issue has become a major dividing line among progressives (and pop culture at large), who claim homosexuals are being persecuted by Christians. That debate is now over and in ten years, progressives will have everything they've asked for. No more blaming Christians. Our society, with its short attention span, will no longer remember all the political blood spilled over these issues with so little practical bearing.

One of my best friends is a raging liberal and we hashed this out recently. He joked that now the gay community can finally partake in the misery of marriage. Soon, they'll want to give it back to heterosexuals. While merely a jest, there's some truth to this. When you fight for some ideal and then win, it can be a shallow victory. If your whole identity is wrapped up in fighting "the man" and the struggle is over, you're now left with the real problems and questions in life -- the kind for which Jesus is the best and only answer. As always, some will come to Him and some will not.

I see this as a distraction having been removed. The more society leans toward progressive ideas and has no one to fight against, the more it will see its own philosophical flaws. When you get what you want and you're still miserable, it's an occasion to shift perspective.

[steve]

I would be very happy if you turn out to be correct. The persecution of those alleged to be involved in "hate speech" may die down with no political objectives left to obtain. That would be a relief.

However, I don't think that the homosexual agenda was merely to obtain political recognition. I'm not sure why that even was a significant goal, since it gave no new rights to the homosexual community that they did not already possess with legalized civil unions.

My suspicion is that the same-sex marriage campaign was just a strategy of anti-Christians to find legal occasion against Christianity which can be prosecuted in courts of law—resulting in the silencing of the Christian witness to the social conscience. I guess we will soon see what the effects will be. It saddens me to think that my generation, or my children's, may be the last to know the phenomenon of the normative family.

[jpat1975]

I think this is a move to marginalize Christians, the same way Hamen in Esther used the King Ahasuarus signet to marginalize and try to wipe out the Jews in chapter 3 of that book. You know it's not going to stop there. This is pay back time for Amalek, and a big part of this is due to lack of diligence on the part of God's people, not nipping this in the bud sooner (e.g. in our case, through a better witness to the world, and how drifting ourselves form that, ultimately played a role in society drifting). The tables have been turned, and now God's people are in danger.

BTW, regarding why this particular biblically immoral practice is different is something John Piper gave some thought to recently. I don't agree with his Calvinist stuff, but like how he writes for other subjects, and his sensitivity:

http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/why ... other-sins

Other articles tagged: http://www.desiringgod.org/all-resource ... osexuality

[Jason]

You could be right. But if so, I'm left wondering what our response is to the world who rejects us, except to keep on keepin' on. Despite my liberal friend's objection to saying this, there really is a homosexual agenda and proponents of gay rights are not quiet about admitting this. They just think it's a morally good and honorable cause. To make them question this will be a work of the Holy Spirit and not public protest. We often forget that we're in a battle over hearts.

Remember that scene in "Lord Save Us From Your Followers" where the vocal drag queen is hurling insults at picketing children during a parade? When forced into a moment of contemplation, the drag queen is met with a serious case of guilt and breaks down into tears. Not because of the picket signs but because he became aware of his own actions. It was an educational moment for me. Those in the homosexual movement may make themselves our enemy, but it's not a lost cause. I think we can win them over the way the early church did. By not fighting back and allowing the offender's conscience to take hold.

This might be incredibly naive on my part, but I'm not quite ready to abandon hope. It's not like God has been caught off guard here. Steve, you saw it coming for forty years, how much more the Father of eternity. For all I know, we may be heading for a major revival. Nevertheless, I still wrestle with the original question -- what is our response to being shouted down in the public square? The easy (and correct) answer is love, but what does that look like in our current climate? I'm willing to go out on a limb and say it looks like making friends with our enemies. If they spit in our face, they will answer to their conscience. But if we spit in their face (metaphorically, of course!) then it's our conscience that'll burn.

[steve]

What would happen if we washed the feet of those who call us the haters?

[jpat1975]

We have the truth on our side. They, like us, like anyone - is made in God's image and likeness. They have a conscience, and a lot of this hostility comes - whether or not they realize it - from a resistance to what they know, deep down inside, to be true. That knowledge gives us an edge, that among many things, should allow us to keep our composure in the midst of much hatred sent our way. Making friends and not stooping to carnal tactics will go a long away in winning some of them over.

BTW, I really liked these excerpts:

Three good articles on this from a Christian perspective as well:

"...Ironically, those who say that Christians are bigots are in fact engaging in bigoted behavior. And not just against Christians, but against anyone who holds reservations about “marriage equality.” You do not need to be a Christian to recognize the problems with it. Remember that a bigot is “a person who has very strong, unreasonable beliefs or opinions . . . who will not listen to or accept the opinions of anyone who disagrees.” Society will now not even listen to alternate points of view on the issue. And therein lies the irony..."

http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/the ... r-equality

"...These concepts, by the way, are rooted and grounded in cultural Marxism. That was the goal of Gramscian Marxism. Divide people up into constituencies, and then the way you gain power is by making promises and representing particular constituencies. Now you never give them what you promise, but by creating this idea of constituencies and being the one who is the representative of the constituencies, you gain power and you keep your power to the degree that things don’t get better for your constituency. If things get better for your constituency, you lose your power. So even when gains are made, you have to downplay those and go looking for other things that are problems. That is the way you keep your power..."

http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/is- ... -new-black

"...When I look at another male and experience the butterflies of attraction, I must lay the desire for inappropriate activity with him at the feet of Jesus, and turn toward the superior promises of reward found in pursuing righteousness. If I do this, even though I have experienced the disordered groan of a broken creation, I have not sinned...."

http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/is- ... attraction