"No, I Don't Forgive You"

Discuss topics raised by callers on the radio program
User avatar
Homer
Posts: 2590
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 11:08 pm

Re: "No, I Don't Forgive You"

Post by Homer » Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:27 am

Hi Paidion,

You wrote:
If the person would still be tempted, this is a clear indication that he has not had a change of heart and mind. He might have been sorry when he was caught, and some people call that "repentance" but he would not have repented as indicated by the Biblical word "μετανοια." "μετα" means "change" and "νοια" refers to the mind. Thus "μετανοια" means "change of mind." If the man had truly changed his mind about stealing, then he wouldn't be tempted when placed in the same position. If the employer is unable to trust him, then he did not truly forgive him.
Let's try a simpler, clearer example. Consider a young 18 year old man with "raging hormones". He has been involved in fornication with his girlfriend and multiple others before her. He becomes a Christian and is repentant. He has a change of mind about his past behavior. I do not believe that if he continues to date his girlfriend, who is a willing sex partner, that his change of heart and mind would rule out any temptation.

The following is addressed to Christians who have presumably repented.

1 Corinthians 10:12 (NASB)
12. Therefore let him who thinks he stands take heed that he does not fall.

In the case I cited above, a change of relationship, I believe, is necessary.

User avatar
Paidion
Posts: 4882
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:22 pm
Location: Back Woods of North-Western Ontario

Re: "No, I Don't Forgive You"

Post by Paidion » Thu Sep 13, 2018 11:56 am

Homer, you wrote:Let's try a simpler, clearer example. Consider a young 18 year old man with "raging hormones". He has been involved in fornication with his girlfriend and multiple others before her. He becomes a Christian and is repentant. He has a change of mind about his past behavior. I do not believe that if he continues to date his girlfriend, who is a willing sex partner, that his change of heart and mind would rule out any temptation.
In your example above, Homer, nobody has forgiven anybody. If the fellow had repented, certainly the "willing sex partner" with whom he had been copulating would not have had any reason to forgive him since she didn't think he had done anything wrong. My position concerns only cases in which a person has been wronged and recognizes it, and then truly forgives a repentant offender and takes steps to restore the good relationship that he had with the offender prior to the offence.
Paidion

Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

Avatar shows me at 40 years old. I am now 81.

User avatar
Homer
Posts: 2590
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 11:08 pm

Re: "No, I Don't Forgive You"

Post by Homer » Fri Sep 14, 2018 12:00 am

Hi Paidion,

I wasn't particularly illustrating a case where a person was wronged. What I meant (clumsily) to address was this statement:
If the person would still be tempted, this is a clear indication that he has not had a change of heart and mind.
I do not believe true repentance entails immunity from temptation, particularly where a person is weak in a some way. The person who has embezzled money or molested a child may be determined to never fall again but it is not a loving thing to place the person in circumstances that could tempt the person. I believe we must forgive but trust is another issue and that takes time.

Do you have any scripture that might contradict my position? I would be interested.

Thanks, Homer

User avatar
Paidion
Posts: 4882
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:22 pm
Location: Back Woods of North-Western Ontario

Re: "No, I Don't Forgive You"

Post by Paidion » Fri Sep 14, 2018 12:44 pm

Thank you for that explanation, Homer. I believe that you are right in not putting the person in a position that he might be tempted again.

Somehow, in my mind, this is different from failure to restore a relationship with a person whom you have truly forgiven. To fail to restore such a relationship is more like, "Yes, I have forgiven you, but stay away from me! I don't want to have anything to do with you!"
Paidion

Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

Avatar shows me at 40 years old. I am now 81.

Post Reply

Return to “Radio Program Topics”