legalism?

[Guest]

What is the difference between legalism and following Gods word?

I try to follow Gods word and alot of it seems black and white to me. Yet when I speak to some other Christians I have had them tell me I am being legalistic.

I was raised in a church in my earlier years that I did think was legalistic ( to me it meant no place for compassion and forgiveness within Gods word, following the word by just their heads , not their heart)So I am a little confused some times. Some Christians appear to me to be watering down the word or adding a twist to it in areas that seem black and white.I don't want to judge them harshly nor do I want to water down how I follow the Lord.

I'd appreciate any comments. thanks

[Guest]

Hi Glow,

In my opinion, you should let nobody judge you for wanting to be obedient to Christ. I think Jesus gave His definition of legalism here:

Mark 7:9
9 And He said to them, "All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition.
NKJV

When traditions are adhered rather than the greatest commandments (Love God, Love your neighbor), I think you have legalism. But it should not be confused with obedience to your King.

The term "Legalism" is often bandied about by those who want to believe in cheap grace.

[Guest]

Thank you Christopher.

I think you hit it on the head. The trouble I always seemed to run into when following Gods word as I read and took it in was the loving your neighbor part. Folks claimed to love God but consistantly It seemed to me they were mssing the common curtesy aspects of just being kind in action and word.

I am sure I miss the mark there also some times. But some of it seems so blatant. And being a woman I know I tend to step down and not say to much after I am labeled as being legalistic in my observation of the word.

I feel like they are trying to discredit me some times, which they may be so I take it to God ( praying deeply some times, so I don't blow my top...lol).

I am working on following Gods spirit to lead me on level ground!

[Guest]

Another way I like to think about the difference is this...

legalistic people focus on what others shouldn't do
lovers of God's Word focus on what they should do

[Guest]

Matt and Christopher have explained the difference very well. From my own experience I've found that people who are true legalists usually read the bible the least. Those who take Christ and his teachings seriously simply cannot forget the greatest commandment of all, to love God and neighbor. They might read the passage but they don't "hide God's word in their hearts." Jesus said that unless his teachings are actually applied, the knowledge of them means nothing. It's impossible for me to read through the entirety of the new testament and not know what God's personality is like. How others fail to do so seems very odd to me.

Just from what you've written I can tell that you are a humble servent of the Lord. Remember, no servent is above his master and if they insulted Christ, they'll do the same to us. It's hard when those insulting us and our ways are in the church, but one can only do so much. I've experienced exactly what you're talking about. Continue to meditate on scripture and be lead by the Spirit. Those who chastise you will answer to God for trying to stumble a true disciple. For now, forgive them and try to live peaceably with your own conscience. God bless.

[Guest]

I have long been troubled by the term "legalist". We run into difficulty when we use non-biblical terms to describe biblical ideas. Is a person who insists on obedience to Christ in all He commanded a legalist? Some seem to think so. Legalist is a handy term to apply, as it all too often is, to someone who insists on obedience in a matter that does not agree with one's own opinion.

Paul informs us of what our attitude should be toward the "legalist", Romans 14:4; "Who are you to judge another's servant? To his own master he stands or falls." And 14:13; "Therefore let us not judge one another anymore..."

It seems to me the real legalist is someone who trusts in himself (the Pharisee in Luke 18:9-13) rather than Christ, whose confidence is in obeying rules rather than having an attidude of obedience because of a desire to please Christ.

[Anonymous]

Do you think that sometimes a person who is experiencing conviction because of sin may call another person a 'legalist' in order to sooth their conscience?

I've been thinking about the discussion on Bob George, and it seems to me that if you take his theology to the logical conclusion, then everything you do is 'ok' because you've already been forgiven. Someone who thinks that way may find someone who is trying to follow Jesus's teaching a close as possible a 'legalist.' (I don't know if Mr. George thinks or says this, I'm just using his name because it came up on this forum.)

Here's an example from my life: My brothers and sister and I were raised in a Baptist church where we had to read this covenant aloud where we promised not to buy or sell alcohol. We all pretty much like alcohol. My sister and I had a huge argument one time about serving alcohol at a party where a woman was attending who had problems with alcohol due to having had an alcoholic father. My sister said that we have freedom to serve alcohol if she wants. I said that I didn't want to cause that sister to stumble. She called me a legalist.

[Guest]

Michelle,
I believe your sister was wrong in calling you a legalist of the example you gave. What it is instead is obiedience to God's word in consideration of another persons feelings.

[Guest]

Thankyou everyone for your helpful advise so far.It sure is nice to have other true believers opinions.It is very healing to me, to say the least

Michelle, I wanted to say to you several years back I used to be a vegetarian.I still go in and out at times. I belonged to PETA. I ended up parting with them for many reasons. I wrote a letter to one of the heads there once regarding the Lord allowing us to eat meat, when He questioned why I left.. I believed it was already predestined because in Gods word way back in Genesis He tells us, He created stock.

Well, all that I know of stock animals they are for food and sacrificed. I am not as knowledgable as many of you so maybe I am off here in my wording literally.. And after all God is Alpha and Omega and knows the beginning and end of everything.He also said it was ok for us to eat everything, even though not necessarily good for all ( I know I am paraphrasing here)

Well he quoted the scripture where we are not to do things that are offending to another. And then proceeded to tell me how much I offended him by eating meat. He sent me a book titled The slaughter of terrified beasts. I don't remember the author but He was a pastor.

In the pastors position He felt since earlier sacrifices of animals came with the downfall in the garden , than the leading of the way to Christs final sacrifice for us all came through animals deaths , shouldn't we be past that sacrifice. Killing animals? We should not eat animals anymore?

I will honestly say, it did make me think. But at the same time I was not eating at his table.If I was to take that logic, how could I know when anything I did might offend some one else, any where on this planet, that I was not around beyond Christ.

I have vegetarians in my family now and do not eat meat in front of them if it offends them. I think your suggestion of not serving alcohol at this gathering because of your friends sensitivity was very kind and compassionate. I would not call it legalistic.

[Guest]

I have found Paul's teachings in I Corinthians 10 and Romans 14 as specific concerning the question as anything in all of scripture:

I Corinthians 10:18-11:1

18 Consider the people of Israel; are not those who eat the sacrifices partners in the altar?
19 What do I imply then? That food offered to idols is anything, or that an idol is anything?
20 No, I imply that what pagans sacrifice they offer to demons and not to God. I do not want you to be partners with demons.
21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons. You cannot partake of the table of the Lord and the table of demons.
22 Shall we provoke the Lord to jealousy? Are we stronger than he?
23 "All things are lawful," but not all things are helpful. "All things are lawful," but not all things build up.
24 Let no one seek his own good, but the good of his neighbor.
25 Eat whatever is sold in the meat market without raising any question on the ground of conscience.
26 For "the earth is the Lord’s, and everything in it."
27 If one of the unbelievers invites you to dinner and you are disposed to go, eat whatever is set before you without raising any question on the ground of conscience.
28 (But if some one says to you, "This has been offered in sacrifice," then out of consideration for the man who informed you, and for conscience’ sake—
29 I mean his conscience, not yours—do not eat it.) For why should my liberty be determined by another man’s scruples?
30 If I partake with thankfulness, why am I denounced because of that for which I give thanks?
31 So, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God.
32 Give no offense to Jews or to Greeks or to the church of God,
33 just as I try to please all men in everything I do, not seeking my own advantage, but that of many, that they may be saved.
1 Be imitators of me, as I am of Christ.

Romans 14:1-15:1
1 As for the man who is weak in faith, welcome him, but not for disputes over opinions.
2 One believes he may eat anything, while the weak man eats only vegetables.
3 Let not him who eats despise him who abstains, and let not him who abstains pass judgment on him who eats; for God has welcomed him.
4 Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Master is able to make him stand.
5 One man esteems one day as better than another, while another man esteems all days alike. Let every one be fully convinced in his own mind.
6 He who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. He also who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God; while he who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God.
7 None of us lives to himself, and none of us dies to himself.
8 If we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord; so then, whether we live or whether we die, we are the Lord’s.
9 For to this end Christ died and lived again, that he might be Lord both of the dead and of the living.
10 Why do you pass judgment on your brother? Or you, why do you despise your brother? For we shall all stand before the judgment seat of God;
11 for it is written, "As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to God."
12 So each of us shall give account of himself to God.
13 Then let us no more pass judgment on one another, but rather decide never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother.
14 I know and am persuaded in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but it is unclean for any one who thinks it unclean.
15 If your brother is being injured by what you eat, you are no longer walking in love. Do not let what you eat cause the ruin of one for whom Christ died.
16 So do not let your good be spoken of as evil.
17 For the kingdom of God is not food and drink but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit;
18 he who thus serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men.
19 Let us then pursue what makes for peace and for mutual upbuilding.
20 Do not, for the sake of food, destroy the work of God. Everything is indeed clean, but it is wrong for any one to make others fall by what he eats;
21 it is right not to eat meat or drink wine or do anything that makes your brother stumble.
22 The faith that you have, keep between yourself and God; happy is he who has no reason to judge himself for what he approves.
23 But he who has doubts is condemned, if he eats, because he does not act from faith; for whatever does not proceed from faith is sin.
1 We who are strong ought to bear with the failings of the weak, and not to please ourselves;