Is our life-span fixed?

[robbyyoung]

Are you saying Eve couldn't have just said "no." That God was hoping to make Adam and Eve sin!? I have no doubt at all God wept the day Adam and Eve broke his one law.

dizerner, I know this was addressed to steve7150, but, God knew Eve wouldn't say NO. God knew Adam and Eve would sin. If there was any weeping, it was done long before HE created MAN. How do we know this? Because Christ was slain BEFORE the foundation of the world! Therefore, these events HAD TO HAPPEN! Christ was ALREADY slain in the timeless existence of God. What, do you think God slew Christ by MISTAKE before anything was created? Come on now, is God infallible or not? In order for MAN to exist in God's image, this is what HAD TO HAPPEN.

God Bless.

[dizerner]

[user account removed]

[robbyyoung]

Well that's just a chicken or egg problem.

The sin necessitates the sacrifice, the sacrifice does not necessitate the sin.

dizerner, God knew and provided an answer for giving MAN Freewill. God's knowing comes first, not MAN's sin. There's no chicken or egg problem.

God Bless.

[dizerner]

[user account removed]

[Paidion]

God created Satan to worship him and never at any point in time was God the author of evil, nor did he desire evil. To say so, is to me, blasphemous.

Actually, dizerner, you are right. It is not only blasphemous to you—it is objectively blasphemous. If this seems too strong language to some, consider the meaning of "blasphemous". The Greek adjective is "βλασφημος" (blasphāmos). Greek lexicons define this word as "speaking evil of". the word is derived from the verb "βλαπτω" (blaptō), which means "to hurt, harm, injure" and φημη (fāmā) which means "fame". So to blaspheme someone is to injure his fame, that is to say something which will make him appear less in the eyes of others than he is reputed to be. And this is EXACTLY what those are doing to God who say that He is the author of evil, or that He planned that there would be evil upon the earth. It blasphemes the character of God making His character out to be something less than LOVE.

But consider what the apostle John said about the very ESSENCE of God:

God is LOVE I John 4:8, 4:16

This is the message we have heard from him [Jesus] and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. (I John 1:5)

Nowhere did Jesus say that the Father creates evil, kills people, orders women's hands to be cut off, orders that rebellious sons be stoned, etc.
Heb 1:3 declares that Jesus is the EXACT IMPRINT of the Father's ESSENCE. Thus the Son has exactly the same nature as the Father. Never did Jesus kill anyone, order his disciples to cut off women's hands or stone rebellious sons. Indeed, he dealt adequately with a group of Pharisees who would have stoned to death an adulterous woman, if they could have gotten away with it. Of course, they wouldn't have actually carried it out under Rome, since Roman law would not have permitted it.

Did you know that the 1650 Connecticut code included "Capitall Lawes" which required the death penalty for particular offences, and based on the Mosaic law? Would those who believe that the Mosaic law is the just law of God be okay with a government which incorporated these laws and penalties into our present legal system?

[robbyyoung]

God created Satan to worship him and never at any point in time was God the author of evil, nor did he desire evil. To say so, is to me, blasphemous.

Actually, dizerner, you are right. It is not only blasphemous to you—it is objectively blasphemous. If this seems too strong language to some, consider the meaning of "blasphemous". The Greek adjective is "βλασφημος" (blasphāmos). Greek lexicons define this word as "speaking evil of". the word is derived from the verb "βλαπτω" (blaptō), which means "to hurt, harm, injure" and φημη (fāmā) which means "fame". So to blaspheme someone is to injure his fame, that is to say something which will make him appear less in the eyes of others than he is reputed to be. And this is EXACTLY what those are doing to God who say that He is the author of evil, or that He planned that there would be evil upon the earth. It blasphemes the character of God making His character out to be something less than LOVE.

Paidion you're wrong! Yeshua killed the Jews in 70AD. As a matter of fact, HE desired and used the Roman Army to do it! Again, evil or "ra" is just by the hands of a Righteous God. "ra" is part of God's character, what are you talking about??? God destroyed and killed many, many, people through the course of history, again, what in the world are you talking about???

Yeshua pour out the most wrathful judgement on Israel that the world will never see again. Yes, HE killed and slaughtered them! What are you talking about???

God Bless.

[RICHinCHRIST]

I just read this entire thread. Interesting conversation. Hello robbyyoung, nice to meet you. I'm sorry to say that I am also in agreement with these contrary opinions expressed against your view, but I'm sure that doesn't shake you from your convictions. Your zeal is admirable.

I feel like all of your points have been adequately addressed except one scripture you referenced in passing twice:


It is your contention that God kills whomever He wishes whenever He desires to do so. I cannot disagree with that statement, since all men are sinners and deserve death, and God can end anyone's life early and it would not be unjust for him to do so. However, you mistakenly have said that God killed "children" in the above verse quoted. This is inaccurate. This word "youths" applied to Joseph when he was 39 (Genesis 41:12), to Absalom as an adult (2 Samuel 14:21, 18:5), and to Solomon when he was 20 (1 Kings 3:7). These were not little harmless kids making fun of a bald man cause he looked funny (And funny he looked I'm sure considering Elisha's protege was less than a fashion mogul LOL). Clearly these were older people and were calling out to Elisha and cursing his ministry and the God he served. Bethel at this time was infamous for pagan calf worship according to Bible scholar Donald Wiseman. These youths were mocking from a perspective of direct opposition to the worship of the true and living God. Elisha cursed them and God judged them because they were attacking His chosen vessel at that time. With that context understood, it is a very different picture than God just delighting in killing innocent children for an innocuous joke on his balding head.

Paidion you're wrong! Yeshua killed the Jews in 70AD. As a matter of fact, HE desired and used the Roman Army to do it! Again, evil or "ra" is just by the hands of a Righteous God. "ra" is part of God's character, what are you talking about??? God destroyed and killed many, many, people through the course of history, again, what in the world are you talking about???

Yeshua pour out the most wrathful judgement on Israel that the world will never see again. Yes, HE killed and slaughtered them! What are you talking about???

God Bless.

There is no doubt that God has judged countless individuals and nations in history. This is because they deserved to die as a just punishment. However, Jesus didn't desire to kill all the Jews in Jerusalem in his day. He actually desired the opposite. But the judgment was poured out because of their disobedience and rejection of His new covenant and kingdom.

[Paidion]

What are you talking about???

I think it is obvious what I am talking about. I am talking about Jesus and the way He depicted His Father, both by word and example.
He revealed the character of God as only the Son of God knows it—and that differs considerably from the way He is frequently depicted by the ancient Israelites.

Concerning the charcter of God, whom are you going to believe? The Son of God who knows Him best? Or Moses and the Prophets who knew Him only partially?

[dizerner]

[user account removed]

[robbyyoung]

I just read this entire thread. Interesting conversation. Hello robbyyoung, nice to meet you.

Hello Brother,

Nice to meet you too.

God Bless.