What is the law in New Covenant?

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What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by verbatim » Tue Aug 16, 2011 11:00 pm

Hi all,
God in sundry times had made covenant in our forefathers from Adam, Abraham, Moses and etc. and seeing that it was faultless and need to be
amended He prophesied in book of Jeremiah 31:31-32 that He shall make a New Covenant in the house of Israel and house of Judah

It was also written in Hebrews 7:18-19 For there is disanulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
v.19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did , by the which we draw nigh unto God.
Hebrews 8:7 For if that covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

Our Lord Jesus Christ being the mediator of the New Covenant knowing that a covenant is of force while the testator liveth give his life for the
redemption of the sins of the world.Hebrews 8:10-11 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days; saith the
LORD: I will put my laws into their mind and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me my people.
v.11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying ,Know the LORD: for all shll know me, from the least to the greatest.

This remind me of the "LORD'S SUPPER" on the night that Lord Jesus was betrayed, when he pick up a bread and brake it and said, Take, eat: This is
my body which is broken for you: do this in remembrance of me and after the same manner took the cup, when he had supped,This cup is the new testament
in my blood: this do ye in remembrance of me.

He gaves this commandment before he died knowing that the testament is of force while the testator liveth and according to the manner of man; though
it be a man's covenant, yet it be confirmed, no man disanulleth and added thereto.

What is the law added in the New Covenant that shall be written in our mind and hearts? if, nothing, that means we're still in Old Covenant.
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Re: What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by Paidion » Thu Aug 18, 2011 11:41 am

The Law of Christ is mentioned a couple of times in the New Testament:

1 Corinthians 9:21 To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law.
Galatians 6:2 Bear one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.


As I see it, the Law of Christ is the law of LOVE. If we bear one another's burdens, we fulfill the law of Christ. This law is "written in the heart" of every true disciple.

I think the Law of Christ also includes all of Christ's instructions in "the Sermon on the Mount" in Matthew 5,6, and 7, as well as any other instructions Christ gave to His disciples. For the carrying out of these instructions is also Love and concern for others.
Paidion

Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

Avatar shows me at 75 years old. I am now 83.

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Re: What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by verbatim » Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:14 pm

Paidion wrote:The Law of Christ is mentioned a couple of times in the New Testament:

1 Corinthians 9:21 To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law.
Galatians 6:2 Bear one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.


As I see it, the Law of Christ is the law of LOVE. If we bear one another's burdens, we fulfill the law of Christ. This law is "written in the heart" of every true disciple.

I think the Law of Christ also includes all of Christ's instructions in "the Sermon on the Mount" in Matthew 5,6, and 7, as well as any other instructions Christ gave to His disciples. For the carrying out of these instructions is also Love and concern for others.
Hello Paidion,
Thank you for your judicious reply and I agree with with your insight of the law of Christ. John 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one
another; as I love you, that ye also love one another.

Romans 13:8-10 Owe no man anything, but to love one another:for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
v.9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
Thou shalt not covet, and if there be any othe commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. v.10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbor: therefore love is fulfilling of the law.

So, I think this not a new commandment for the same law was given in Torah and has just been repeated almost through out the Scripture. We must know
if what is the new commandment that will enhance our spiritual growth not by the deed of flesh but by work of sanctification of Holy Ghost in one self.

1 John 2:7 Brethren , I write no new commandment, but an old commandment which ye had heard form the beginning, The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning. John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.1 Peter 1:23

Thank you and God bless.
verbatim
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Re: What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by verbatim » Fri Aug 26, 2011 9:09 pm

Hi All;
In light of circumstances after more than a week with nobody seem to post reply, I being the author of this thread decided to give additional share to
clarify my position.

Some says that the moral law has been superceded by the law of grace and, law of liberty, and law of Christ that is to love one another. John 13:hey offerd

An agreement or a testament is composed of rules and ordinances between man and God and Jesus is anointed as mediator of a better covenant which
establish upon better promises. Hebrews 8:7 For if that covenant (old) had been faultless, then should no place sought for the second.
Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being change, there is made of necessity a change also in law.

What is the fault or weakness find in old covenant of law ? Hebrews 1-10 For the law having the shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of
the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.v.2 For then would they not have
ceased to be offered ? because that the worshipers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. v. 3 But in those sacrifices there is remembrance
again made of sins every year.v.4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but " A BODY THOU HAST PREPARED ME: Then said I, Lo
come ( in the volume of the book it is written of me ) to do thy will O God. v.8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither
hadst pleasure therein, which were offered by the law; v.9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God, He taketh the first, that he may establish the second.

v, 10 By which we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once and for all. Jesus gave his life and died for us; what is his commandment?

Hebrews 10:17 For a testament is of force after a man is dead: otherwise it is no strength at all while the testator liveth. Jesus knowing this he give commandment to his disciples before he was persecuted. 1 Corinthians 11:23-26 For I have received of the Lord that which I also delivered unto you,
that the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread: v.24 And when had given thanks, he brake it, and said, TAKE, EAT : THIS IS MY
BODY, WHICH IS BROKEN FOR YOU: THIS DO IN REMEMBRANCE OF ME. After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, THIS
CUP IS THE NEW TESTAMENT IN MY BLOOD: this do ye, as oft as you drink it, in remembrance of me.

This affirmed his doctrine in John 6:48-58 I am the bread of life. Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead. This the bread that cometh
down from heaven: that a man may eat thereof, and not die. I am the living bread which came down from heaven; he shall live forever and the bread that
I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

v.53 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you,v.4 Whoso eateth my flesh and
drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. v.55 For my flesh is meat indeed and my blood is drink indeed. v.56 He that
eateth my flesh and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him. v.57 As the living Father has sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me,
even he shall live by me.v. 58 This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as of your father did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live forever.

How could we understand this doctrine? ? ? Let us look if what is Jesus before he incarnate or before he was sent to world by God the Father.

John 1:1-2 In the beginning was the WORD and the WORD was with God and the WORD is God. The same was in the beginning with God. John 1:14 And the
WORD was made flesh ( body) and dwelt among us ( and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Jesus name which was called "The Word of God" Revelation 19:13 This affirm the words of Jeremiah 15:16 Thy words were found, and I did eat them; and the word was unto me the joy and rejoicing of mine heart; for I am called by thy name, O LORD God of hosts.

Galatians 3:22-27 But the Scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given o them that believe. v.23 But
before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. v.24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster
For we are all children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. v.27 For as many as you have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Hope this help.
your brother in Christ.
verbatim
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Re: What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by jriccitelli » Sun Aug 28, 2011 2:32 am

Hello, I believe we are 'saved so that we can keep the Law'. The Law was fullfilled but not eliminated. The Law was changed but not rewrote, 'we' fullfill the Law 'through' Christ, Christ fullfills the Law in us and through us, as we are His body. It is not the symbolic aspects, it is now the real deal. It is not the outward appearance of the law as in the cutting of beards but the inward Law that comes from the heart. We fullfill the Law of sacrifices with our time and life, freewill offerings and peace offerings to others and to God. The Law is not to steal or cheat, it is to honor mother and father, it is to know the clean from the unclean. The Holy Spirit now makes the Law personal to each man and woman, no amount of writing could ever contain all the instructions that the Holy Spirit gives us in our life, the written Law of Moses is our guide to understand and know the Holy Spirit. Christ is God, the Law of Christ is the law of God, the Law of God is His Word. The Word for Christ and the disiples was the Words of Moses and the Prophets. Jesus the disciples and paul always refer us back to the Torah. The law and the Covenants are different yet woven together. We may not be under the mosaic covenant but we certainly are participants in the Abrahamic covenant. As James says ' the perfect law of liberty', the Law is made perfect by grace through the blood of Christ. We as gentiles are not 'under' the law, but we Love the Law*, "if you love me you will keep my commandments". And we uphold the law, knowing the Law did not save us but as it revealed to Israel, it shows us our need for God, our need to repent, it reveals Gods holiness and His character as well as His will for us. To do His will is to know all His Word, New Testament and first. Just because the law can be fullfilled in one word (Gal.5:14) it is not 'understood' by one word, obviously Jesus is not saying 'forget the Torah just love people!" I know too many christians who suppose to have the law written on their heart but have nothing written on their forehead (or brain) Why do you call me lord but do not do as i commanded? Anyways. just my thoughts on this God bless
(*Nothing dogmatic, but I think that as we mature in Christ, we grow in our love for Gods Word 'and His Law', Moses and the Prophets. If you truly love one another, you love to love, thus you love His commandments as David says in Psalm 119. If you dont love out of love, is it really love? If you love because you 'have to' is that love? Therefore 'to love' is to love His commandments. Note: John 14:21, 15:10)
Last edited by jriccitelli on Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:35 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by verbatim » Sun Aug 28, 2011 4:13 am

Hello jricccitelli greetings;
Thank you for your judicious response which show your discerning ability to acknowledge the law of love Jesus has preaches to us. I agreed for most of
what you said, but I would like to share with you that in works under the law we shall not be sanctified .

Galatians 3:2-5 This only would I learn of you, Did you received the Spirit by the works of the law, or by hearing of faith?
v. 3 Are you so foolish ? having begun in the Spirit, are you now made perfect by the flesh ?
v.4 Have you suffer many things in vain > if yet in vain ?
v.5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and work miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith.
v.6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

In the Spirit-Not merely was Christ crucified "graphically set forth" in my preaching, but also "the Spirit" confirmed the word preached, by imparting His spiritual gifts. "Having thus begun" with the receiving His spiritual gifts, "are ye now being made perfect", that is, are ye seeking to be made perfect with "fleshly" ordinances of the law?
Having begun in the Spirit, that is, the Holy Spirit ruling your spiritual life as its "essence and active principle" in contrast to "the flesh," the element in which the law works. Having begun your Christianity in the Spirit, that is, in the divine life that proceeds from faith, are ye seeking after something higher still (the perfecting of your Christianity) in the sensuous and the earthly, which cannot possibly elevate the inner life of the Spirit, namely, outward ceremonies?

No doubt the Galatians thought that they were going more deeply into the Spirit; for the flesh may be easily mistaken for the Spirit, even by those who have made progress, unless they continue to maintain a pure faith and be justified and sanctified through the glory of Christ.

Galatians 2:16 Knowing a man is not justified by works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be
justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law; for the work of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Romans 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
Romans 11:6 And it by grace it is no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace; otherwise works is no more works. Thank you and God bless.

your brother in Christ.
virgilio
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Re: What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by jriccitelli » Sun Aug 28, 2011 11:46 am

This is interesting, because when I mention keeping the Law many christians think I am saying we 'HAVE TO' obey the Law' .I am saying we should 'WANT TO' obey, or keep his commands. The Law does 'not JUSTIFY us, but it sanctifys us, "For you have been born again, not of seed which is perishable but of imperishable, through the Living and abiding word of God... like newborn babes long for the pure milk of the word, that by it you may grow in respect to salvation" (1 Peter 1:23, 2:2)
All scripture Torah and new test. tell us to obey His commands, most every single page Genesis through Psalms, Proverbs through John, Acts through Phillipians, Peter, james and John, "for this is the love of God that we keep His commandments; and his commandments are not burdensome, for whatever is born of God overcomes the world" (1John 5;3-4)
I know what your saying, but that is not what i am saying. I also use that great verse in Gal. 3:2 often in my conversations and debates with legalists, Seventh day adventists, mormons, Jw's, etc. I show them that we 'cannot' keep the Law, for one; there is no more Temple, and there is no more Levitical priesthood, and two; we are not called to be Jewish, but we are 'called to be holy'' "but like the Holy one who called you be holy yourselfs also in all your behavior because it is written "you shall be holy for I am Holy ... conduct yourselfs in fear during your time of stay on earth' (1Peter 1;15) but you are a chosen race a royal priesthood, a holy nation (1peter 2:9) Therefore since Christ has suffered in the flesh arm yourselves also with the same purpose, because he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, so as to live the rest of his time in the flesh no longer for the lusts of men but for the will of God" (1 Peter 4:1-2) Is it not Paul who reminds us of the commandments over and over as in Ephesians 6:7. Why do the new testament writers stress being good, holy, charitable. obiedient if holiness is for nothing? The Law is our guide to what is written on the heart; Ezekiel prophesied "I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you ...and cause you to walk in my ordinances (36;26-27) and "I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it (Jeremiah 31'33) Circumcision used to be of the flesh but we have recieved the spirit of circumcision, "we serve in newness of the spirit, and not in oldness of the letter" (Romans 7:6) So then on one hand I myself with my mind am serving the law of God, but on the other with my flesh the law of sin (Romans 7:25) I live by grace, thus freed to obey out of love, I appreciate your response for i enjoy Steves teaching and it is good to share doctrine.
Last edited by jriccitelli on Mon Aug 29, 2011 2:43 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by verbatim » Sun Aug 28, 2011 8:41 pm

hello brother greetings;
jriccitelli wrote: This is interesting, because when I mention keeping the Law many christians think I am saying we 'have to obey the Law' I am saying we should 'WANT TO' obey, or keep his commands. The Law does 'not justify' us but it sanctifys us, "For you have been born again, not of seed which is perishable but of imperishable, through the Living and abiding word of God... like newborn babes long for the pure milk of the word, that by it you may grow in respect to salvation" (1 Peter 1:23, 2:2)

Verbatim quote:
Good point ; This a must for every man to be born again by the imperishable seed which is the living and abiding word of God. But this seed or the word of
God is easy to say but being a parable is not commonly understood as being prophesied in Amos 8:11-12 Behold the days come, saith the Lord, that I will send
a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst of water, but of the hearing of the word of God. v.12 And they shall wander from from sea to sea, and from north even to the east they shall run to and fro seek the word of the Lord, and shall not find it.

jriccielli quote:
All scripture Torah and new test. tell us to obey His commands, most every single page Genesis through Psalms, Proverbs through John, Acts through Phillipians, Peter, james and John, "for this is the love of God that we keep His commandments; and his commandments are not burdensome, for whatever is born of God overcomes the world" (1John 5;3-4)

verbatim quote:
Agree.

jriccitelli quote:
I know what your saying, but that is not what i am saying. I use that great verse in Gal. 3:2 often in my conversations
I show them that we 'cannot' keep the Law, for one there is no more Temple, and there is no more Levitical priesthood, and two we are not called to be Jewish, but we are 'called to be holy'' "but like the Holy one who called you be holy yourselfs also in all your behavior because it is written "you shall be holy for I am Holy ... conduct yourselfs in fear during your time of stay on earth

verbatim quote:
We are being justify and sanctify not by own works and righteousness but the unblemished and unspotted blood of Jesus which offer for the remission of our sins and through the word of truth of the Father John 17:17

jriccitelli quote:
' (1Peter 1;15) but you are a chosen race a royal priesthood, a holy nation (1peter 2:9) Therefore since Christ has suffered in the flesh arm yourselves also with the same purpose, because he who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, so as to live the rest of his time in the flesh no longer for the lusts of men but for the will of God" (1 Peter 4:1-2) Is it not Paul who reminds us of the commandments over and over as in Ephesians 6:7. Why do the new testament writers stress being good, holy, charitable. obiedient if holiness is for nothing?

verbatim quote:
Being a chosen race as a royal priesthood one must know if what is the new commandment of the Lord that he accomplished in the cross when he said"it's finished". When Jesus died on the cross and gave up the ghost, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom meaning the glory was
unveil unlike Moses when he faces his people to cover the glory in his face which the glory was t be done away.

jriccitelli quote:
The Law is our guide to what is written on the heart; Ezekiel prophesied "I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you ...and cause you to walk in my ordinances (36;26-27) and "I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it (Jeremiah 31'33) Circumcision used to be of the flesh but we have recieved the spirit of circumcision, "we serve in newness of the spirit, and not in oldness of the letter" (Romans 7:6) So then on one hand I myself with my mind am serving the law of God, but on the other with my flesh the law of sin (Romans 7:25) I live by grace, thus freed to obey out of love, I appreciate your response for i enjoy Steves teaching and it is good to share doctrine.

verbatim quote:
Back to topic, Hebrews 8:7-8 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second. v.8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.

The fault or gap that was find here is Heb 10:5-6 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast
thou prepared me. v.6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast no pleasure.v 7 Then said I , Lo, I come ( in the volume of the book it is written of me)
to do the will O God.
So, Jesus substituted his own life, body, and blood as a propitiation for the remission of our sin. From here comes the commandment of Jesus on which he
teaches his disciples in the Lord's Supper. Saying, This is my body which is broken for you. Take, eat, do this in remembrance of me,And then after the same manner; after he gave than,ks took the cup and sup, after he supped he gave it to them saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood; this do in remembrance of me. related verse; Lk 22:16-20 John 6:48-58, Mark 14:22-25, Matt 26:26-29, 1 Cor 11:23-26

Thank you and God Bless.
your brother in Christ
virgilio
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Re: What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by jriccitelli » Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:08 am

Hello other brother virgilio, its cool to talk to someone out there who is christian, I believe u r a born again believer, so i will ask you; Do you honor your mother and father? Do u steal or commit adultery, do u covet your neighbors house, I know u dont want to do these things, why not do them, is it because u love God, mabey. U want to obey the Law, why? Because it is written on your heart? The Holy Spirit urges u 2. Yes. U are obeying the Law (of God) written on your heart. Are u not then obeying the law of God? Do u have the law of God written on your heart or not?
I dont mean to sound harsh but I think u know I am just expressing this way as a literary form, but I am trying to find common ground on this and different opinions are benificial. john
i think Gods Holy Spirit enlightens Gods Word, and His Law as we read the Old testament, and when we read it we conform to the image of God, because he is the Word. and the Word is made flesh in us, the word implanted in us.

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Re: What is the law in New Covenant?

Post by verbatim » Mon Aug 29, 2011 1:18 am

jriccitelli wrote:Hello other brother virgilio, its cool to talk to someone out there who is christian, I believe u r a born again believer,

Hello brother John,
Thank you for your interest to chat and share with me and it's a pleasure to be your company. Yes, I'm a born again in God's word and in Spirit but I'm a non member of any denomination. I share the table of fellowship by joining different bible forum and house to house fellowship here at home.

John quote:
so i will ask you; Do you honor your mother and father? Do u steal or commit adultery, do u covet your neighbors house, I know u dont want to do these things, why not do them, is it because u love God, mabey. U want to obey the Law, why?

virgilio quote:
Both my father and mother where now deceased but I still love them. Ephesians 6:1-2 Children, love your parents in the Lord: for this is right.? ? ? v.2-3 Honour
thy father and mother: which is the first commandment with promise; that it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earht.
Romans 13:8, 10 Owe no man anything, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
v. 10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbor: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

John quote:
Because it is written on your heart? The Holy Spirit urges u 2. Yes. U are obeying the Law (of God) written on your heart. Are u not then obeying the law of God? Do u have the law of God written on your heart or not?

virgilio quote:
I know two types of law a physical and spiritual, Yes, I try not to loss the law in my heart and mind, but more is the spiritual law that was written in my book of memory Malachi 3:16 with the words which are pure language that are given by the Lord Zephaniah 3:9 which are pure words; as silver tried in a furnace
of the earth, purified seven times. Psalm 12:6

John quote:
I dont mean to sound harsh but I think u know I am just expressing this way as a literary form, but I am trying to find common ground on this and different opinions are benificial. john

virgilio quote:
You are welcome my brother.

John quote:
i think Gods Holy Spirit enlightens Gods Word, and His Law as we read the Old testament, and when we read it we conform to the image of God, because he is the Word. and the Word is made flesh in us, the word implanted in us.

virgilio quote
I agree, James 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your soul.
Thank you and God bless.
your brother in Christ.
virgilio
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