Is it possible that Satan had not yet fallen when He tempted Eve-i.e. that his being "cast out" happened soon thereafter?
TK
Satan's Fall
Satan's Fall
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Reason:
"Were not our hearts burning within us? (Lk 24:32)
What are you referring to as his "fall"?
Most people use that term to speak of an initial rebellion against God, in which they assume Satan became involved, though he had been a righteous being prior to that. As a result of this rebellion, he became the devil, and was expelled from heaven. If you are using the term in this ordinary way, then it would seem that any such "fall" would have to have occurred prior to his tempting Eve, since he would not have been engaged in such activities if he were an unfallen, righteous being.
On the other hand, if you are not thinking of Satan as a demoted rebel, but are using the term "fall" simply of his being "cast out" of heaven (as in Revelation 12:7-10), then the temptation of Eve would be much too early for this identification, since it was still a future event, four-thousand years after Eve's time, when Jesus spoke of it in John 12:31.
If there is an alternative sense in which you are thinking of the term, I am not sure what you mean by it.
Most people use that term to speak of an initial rebellion against God, in which they assume Satan became involved, though he had been a righteous being prior to that. As a result of this rebellion, he became the devil, and was expelled from heaven. If you are using the term in this ordinary way, then it would seem that any such "fall" would have to have occurred prior to his tempting Eve, since he would not have been engaged in such activities if he were an unfallen, righteous being.
On the other hand, if you are not thinking of Satan as a demoted rebel, but are using the term "fall" simply of his being "cast out" of heaven (as in Revelation 12:7-10), then the temptation of Eve would be much too early for this identification, since it was still a future event, four-thousand years after Eve's time, when Jesus spoke of it in John 12:31.
If there is an alternative sense in which you are thinking of the term, I am not sure what you mean by it.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Reason:
In Jesus,
Steve
Steve
thx, steve.
i always assumed that at some point in time prior to the creation of adam and eve, lucifer rebelled and was cast out of heaven. thus lucifer, in his new persona as satan, tempted eve in the garden.
what i am wondering is whether Lucifer, in his pre-cursed state, committed his first act of treason by tempting Eve.
Ezek 28 says:
further, God's placing adam and eve in the garden with an evil tempter of satan's prowess would seem to be akin to earthly parents putting their young children in a vicious tiger's cage and then hoping for the best, but knowing full well what the outcome will be.
TK
i always assumed that at some point in time prior to the creation of adam and eve, lucifer rebelled and was cast out of heaven. thus lucifer, in his new persona as satan, tempted eve in the garden.
what i am wondering is whether Lucifer, in his pre-cursed state, committed his first act of treason by tempting Eve.
Ezek 28 says:
if this is talking literally about Lucifer (and i know it may not be) it suggests that he was in the garden in his pre-cursed state." 'You were the model of perfection,
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden,
the garden of God;
every precious stone adorned you:
ruby, topaz and emerald,
chrysolite, onyx and jasper,
sapphire, turquoise and beryl.
Your settings and mountings were made of gold;
on the day you were created they were prepared.
14 You were anointed as a guardian cherub,
for so I ordained you.
You were on the holy mount of God;
you walked among the fiery stones.
further, God's placing adam and eve in the garden with an evil tempter of satan's prowess would seem to be akin to earthly parents putting their young children in a vicious tiger's cage and then hoping for the best, but knowing full well what the outcome will be.
TK
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Reason:
"Were not our hearts burning within us? (Lk 24:32)
Re: Satan's Fall
In Ref to the descriptions, that most people assume is Satan/Lucifer (In Isaiah and Ezekiel) that talks about a man/King...., isn't this talking about man, but actually mirroring him to Satan? Or have these descriptions just been assumed as describing Satan by most readers over the ages? Either way it is still not absolutely clear in the Bible of Satan's Fall or his past I don't think.
Re: Satan's Fall
have these descriptions just been assumed as describing Satan by most readers over the ages?
Yes. I believe this is the case.