dseusy wrote:Paidion wrote:You seem to be saying that no one can be righteous. How then can you receive eternal life?
That is exactly what I am saying. With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.
John who wrote 1 John, believed that it was not only possible to be righteous, but that if you aren't righteous, you are not a child of God:
No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him. Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as He is righteous. Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil. No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God. By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother. (1 John 3:6-10 ESV)
John said that whoever practises righteousness IS righteous, not to let anyone deceive me on this point. So I won't. It's a matter of "practising righteousness" and not "practising sinning." Contrary to the Protestant and Fundamentalist "gospel", one doesn't go to hell because one has committed a single sin (or many sins) in the past. One goes to hell because one's nature if sin-sick, self-serving, and rebellious against God. Such a person must be changed, regenerated.The old self-serving person must be destroyed, and the new loving person who serves Christ and his fellow man must come forth. If it takes hell to do it, so be it!
As George MacDonald put it:
Not for any or all of his sins that are past shall a man be condemned; not for the worst of them does he need to fear remaining unforgiven. The sin in which he dwells, the sin of which he will not come out. That sin is the sole ruin of a man. His present live sins, those sins pervading his thoughts and ruling his conduct; the sins he keeps doing, and will not give up; the sins he is called to abandon, but to which he clings instead, the same sins which are the cause of his misery, though he may not know it --- these are the sins for which he is even now condemned.
Ecclesiastes 7:20
Surely there is not a righteous man on earth who does good and never sins.
No one in this forum is arguing against this, nor is anyone of us saying that he/she has never sinned. So to argue that everyone has sinned is attacking a strawman. What you need to try to establish, if I understand your point of view correctly, is that righteousness is unnecessary, that one can live as wicked, self-serving life full of hate and rebellion and still be "saved" through the blood of Christ. Do you really believe the following scenario is a probability on judgment day? Two very evil people, James and George appear before the LORD on that day. Both have raped and torture and murdered. Neither has ever has a revolutionary change in his behaviour. The LORD consults his books. He announces, "James, I see that on February 17, 1990, you accepted Christ as your personal Saviour. Welcome to Heaven! Enter into the joys of the LORD! George, I see that you never did accept Christ. To hell with you! Off to eternal torment." It would be a most serious mistake to think that God cares about whether or not you "accepted Christ" thereby become "positionally righteous." God is not concerned about "positional righteousness"; He is concerned about actual righteousness.
You indicated that my quote of Romans 2;:6-10 is speaking to those under the law. Paul doesn't say that . He says that God will render to
EVERYONE according to his works! Not only to those under the law, but to those under the New Covenant:
For He will render to everyone according to his works.
To those who by perseverance in well-doing seek for glory and honour and immortality,
He will give eternal life, but for those who are self-seeking and are not persuaded by the truth,
but are persuaded by unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury.
Affliction and anguish for every person who does evil, but glory and honour and well-being for
every one who does good
to the Jew and also the Greek, for God shows no partiality. (Romans 2:6-10)
Romans 3:20-24
"Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference; for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus"
The word translated "justified" is simply the verbal form of the noun translated as "righteousness." Sometimes this verb ought to be translated as "made righteous" or (if we need a single word) "righteousified".
So by keeping or attempting to keep the law, no one can be righteous—actually righteous. This REAL righteousness comes only through Christ. This is exactly why Christ died.
He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness. By his wounds you have been healed. (1 Peter 2:24 ESV)
So yes, all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. But we can be made righteous through the enabling grace made available through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
Paul wrote to Titus about this enabling grace:
For the grace of God has appeared for the salvation of all people, training us to renounce impiety and worldly passions, and to live sensible, righteous, and devout lives in the present age, expecting the blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of the great God and of our Savior Jesus Christ, who gave himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own who are zealous for good works. Declare these things; encourage and reprove with all authority. Let no one disregard you. Titus 2:11-15
So the grace of God TRAINS us to renounce impiety and worldly passions, and to live sensible, righteous, and devout lives in the present age. There is a NECESSITY for a change of life style! He said Christ gave Himself to redeem us from what? FROM ALL LAWLESSNESS! To PURIFY for Himself a people who are ZEALOUS FOR GOOD WORKS! This way of life is not optional; it is a requirement for each and everyone.
Jesus said, "Unless you forsake all and follow me, you CANNOT be my disciple." He didn't say that we would be a poor disciple, or a non-functional disciple. He said we couldn't be His disciple AT ALL!
You didn't answer my question, "Do you adhere to all of God's law?"
What do you mean by "God's law"? Are you referring to the Mosaic code? If so, then I unequivocally answer, "NO!"
If by "God' law" you mean the law of Christ as He taught it in Matthew 5, 6, and 7, then I reply that it is my intention to do so. Of course I have not done so perfectly throughout my life. Indeed, I have committed serious sin during part of my life. But as George MacDonald said as quoted above, it is not for past sins that we need fear condemnation, but for our present live sins which we do because of what we are. I have been changed by the grace of God. But I need to coöperate with that grace. I can't become righteous through self-effort. But neither will God sovereignly make me righteous. However, "working together with Him" (2 Corinthians 6:1), I am being changed by Him day by day, so that someday, I will be fully conformed to the image of Christ. I must not accept the grace of God in vain (2 Corinthians 6:1). Thus He who began a good work in me will continue to complete it until the day of Jesus Christ. (Phillipians 1:6). If I continue on the difficult path (or "narrow path") which leads to life, I know I will be pleasing and acceptable to God my Saviour."
