What constitutes "reformed"?

[Quilter2]

When I hear the term "Reformed" I usually think of calvinism and its associated denominations - Reformed churches, Presbyterian, Covenanter, etc. I also think of amil eschatology and the TULIP doctrines.
I am sitting here being Anabaptist but a convinced amil person. I am not dispensational, so does that mean I am in the 'reformed' or 'covenant' camp? Are they the same thing? Are there any other alternatives within the groups generally considered within the pale of orthodox christianity?
And what characteristics delineate these groups?
Thanks
Paula

[steve]

As I understand the term, "Reformed" includes both Calvinism and non-dispensational eschatology. Therefore, I am in the same boat as yourself: Reformed in eschatology, but non-Reformed in soteriology. I don't know if there is a specific name for this.

[Paidion]

From the time I first became aware of "Reformed Churches", I thought the term applied only to Calvinist churches. But the Christian Reformed website indicates that "Reformed Churches are part of a larger family. At their website, under the heading "What is reformed?", the following statement is made:

Reformed Christians are a small part of a much larger body of believers who love and serve Jesus Christ. We’re part of a family that includes Orthodox, Roman Catholic, Anglican, Evangelical, and a host of other churches that confess and practice the Christian faith.

I don't think they are saying that these other parts of "the family" are also "reformed".

In any case, here is the Christian Reformed website:
http://www.crcna.org/welcome/beliefs/re ... t-reformed

[backwoodsman]

I'm currently reading some biographies of a couple of 17th & 18th century German believers. In that context, "Reformed" means specifically followers of Calvin, as opposed to followers of Luther. Meaning, reformed from Catholicism (although evangelicals of the time would've suggested not reformed nearly enough, as would some today). That's the origin of most of the churches of which I'm aware that call themselves Reformed.

I am sitting here being Anabaptist

Would you mind sharing what it is that makes you Anabaptist, as opposed to simply Christian?

[Quilter2]

I would say primarily that I am a Christian, but that I share most of the doctrinal understandings that are mostly associated with conservative Anabaptist churches -- free will, amil eschatology, priority of the NT over the OT (not a "flat Bible" as they say), more congregational than hierarchical church structure, nonresistant/CO as to war and related issues, conditional security rather than "once saved always saved" as is commonly taught. We are on our first marriage almost 29&1/2 yrs and expect it to be permanent, but if there were a divorce some day, I would not feel the liberty to remarry while my husband is living, although I think there may be a case for it after divorce from an adulterous partner. I am not going to pass judgment on somebody for that. There are some things I participate in for the sake of harmony with Anabaptist people although I am not sure I would lay the stress they do on them -- plain dress, headcovering, no jewelry. But these are small issues compared to the weightier ones above. Does that answer your question? Paula

[Jepne]

Hi Paula - I am glad you wrote. Even though we go to an Anabaptist church once every month, I did not know they were amil, or held to free will - though, with the stress they have on discipleship, I could have guessed. They are the most loving and generous people - I love to be with them. They left a very conservative group and have never looked at me different because I do not dress the way they do or wear anything on my head. I appreciate that very much.

[steve]

Not all anabaptists are amillennial. Some are, but it is not an anabaptist distinctive. I think many of the early anabaptists were historic premillennial.

[Jepne]

Thank you for this!

Maybe this is a good place (as any) to bring up a paper I read called ''The Anabaptist Vision'' by Harold Bender (free online), telling the history of the Anabaptists and what they suffered at the hands of the 'reformed' folks - those who followed Luther and Zwingli particularly. Before I read that I'd been very naive about that part of our history.

[Quilter2]

Perhaps I should clarify. Mennonites/Amish like all christians read books in the popular Christian bookstores so they have had influence from other groups because of books, newsletters and Sunday School materials.

We have been hanging around with plain Anabaptists since 1990. In Lancaster Co, PA they would say the Mennonites/Amish were originally Amil. When Evangelist John R. Brunk came up in the Lancaster Conference during the 1940s or 50s, he was premil but probably not Dispensational. His son John R. Brunk II as he is called became charismatic and that is how it entered Lancaster Conference, the oldest conference and probably the largest numerically. The groups that pulled out in the 1940s-1970s to retain the plain distinctives are a mix. The groups whose heritage was not Lanc. Conference like Nationwide Fellowship (Rod&Staff Publishers group) and Mennonite Christian Brotherhood are amil. I believe the Russian Mennonites who settled in the Midwest and Canada were Amil as I have Klassen's booklet on the Peaceful Kingdom meaning the church. I believe I got that from Rod&Staff. The groups that are heritage Lancaster Conference (Hope Fwp early 1970s, Eastern PA Menn 1972/3, Pilgrim Conference split from Eastern (1980s) are premil because of Brunk's influence. Keystone which was the last group to leave Lancaster Conference (over female ordination) c. 1998 does not have eschatology in their doctrine statement. Keystone's discipline does not appear to take a position on eschatology, just that Christ is coming again, judgement etc. I do not know where the car driving Beachy Amish groups or Old Order Amish & Mennonite groups would be on this topic but suspect they tend toward Amil. Horning Mennonite (old order black car) seem to be Amil from reading their publications. Likewise I am not sure about the old state conferences that birthed plain groups (Midwest Mennonite Conference, Canadian Conservative and others). Southeast and South Atlantic which emerged from the old Va. Conference may be premil as their publisher is mostly Christian Light which has publications that sound like historic premil. Bro. Brunk was also active in VA.

I hope this is helpful. We are really sorry to be so far from Mennonite congregations here near St. Louis. Church is 1&3/4 to 2&1/2 hrs. away depending on where we visit. We have been trying to visit them every other week, and go somewhere location the inbetween week just because all that travel is so tiring. We try to get to the mixed plain church events like Christian Aid open house, Christian Music Camp, Bible meetings in IN, and other events.

I so appreciate the fellowship here on the forum.
Blessings to all of you,
Paula