The Narrow Path Ministries

I know that this was recently discussed on another thread (Did God raise God?)- but that thread kind of took off in different directions.

I think we also discussed this on the old forum, at least in passing.

The reason I am bringing it up again is that I have been listening to Steve G's lectures on the Gospel of John, and I have heard him say twice now that Jesus raised Himself from the dead(unless I really misunderstood what he was saying).

I know there are verses that say God raised Jesus from the dead. Then there is a reference made by Jesus to him raising up the temple (his body) in three days.

Obviously, Christianity hangs a lot on the resurrection. It is one of the major proofs we use to say that Jesus was deity.

But if God raised him, how is that any proof that Jesus is deity? After all, Jesus raised Lazarus and others and they are not considered deity.

However, if Jesus raised Himself, then that is pretty awesome and would establish his PERSONAL power over His OWN death (not only of others).

In other words, it seems a much lesser thing if God raised Jesus than if Jesus raised Himself. It sounds strange even saying such a thing but I hope you catch my drift.

Side note: to those of you who lean towards the view that when a person dies, they are dead (no intermediate state) until the resurrection, do you believe this applied to Jesus while he was in the tomb?

TK

The way i take it is that Jesus said he would raise his body - not that he would raise himself from the dead. He then qualifies it by saying that he would receive his life back again. Other than this one passage, there are so many verses that say that God or God the Father raised him from the dead, that it would take a long time just to quote them all!

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TK wrote:Side note: to those of you who lean towards the view that when a person dies, they are dead (no intermediate state) until the resurrection, do you believe this applied to Jesus while he was in the tomb?

Yes, I believe Jesus was REALLY dead, just like anyone else when he dies. It's hard to believe the Son of God Himself really died, and no longer existed until the Father raised Him to life. But then, Jesus, being a complete human being, could do nothing, no miracles at all, except the Father did them through Him. He divested Himself of all His divine attributes when He became a man. He retained nothing except His identity. He was truly the "second Adam".

When we realize that the Son of God REALLY died, we have a much greater appreciation for what it meant for God to give up His only begotten Son for our sake! He truly died, but now is alive, and behold! He is alive forever more!

Merely bringing a body to life, does not have that much significance in my way of thinking. Paul rested everything on the resurrection! He said that if the dead are not raised, then we are of all men most to be pitied, that we may as well eat and drink, for tomorrow we die.

Hmmm. that is the best i can muster at the moment. good thoughts, Paidion.

TK