The Narrow Path Ministries

KJV 2 Tim2:11
It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:
12
If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:
13
If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

There have been various interpretations on this group of verses.
I've heard it was the lyrics to a praise song from that time period.
However - since it's in the Bible I take it to be flawless.
I stand firm in my belief that you can be "in Christ" and be "taken away" as the first few verses of John 15 state.
But the last part of verse 12 and the whole of verse 13 seem to be saying two polar opposite things. I have a feeling maybe that vs. 13 simply means He will be faithful to His warnings of if we deny Him (Matt 10:33).
I also take note that Paul says "we" and "us", including himself in the verse. So it seems as though he is saying that if he were to deny Christ, Christ would deny him. ANd we know Paul to have been saved so therefore I see this as killing the Once Saved Always Saved notion.
Could someone help me put all this together. Thank you...

Verse 13 just means that God remains faithful even if we do not. This in no way says that God will still save someone who is unfaithful, that would contradict scripture everywhere. It's just saying that if we fall away, it's not because God is unfaithful.

Sean wrote:Verse 13 just means that God remains faithful even if we do not. This in no way says that God will still save someone who is unfaithful, that would contradict scripture everywhere. It's just saying that if we fall away, it's not because God is unfaithful.

I guess it is that simple. Ive been on another forum for a couple of months and we've been going back and forth with this and other scriptures. A great deal of them are Calvinists and I have been trying to defend God's right to not give to some eternal life if they fall away from Him.
It's nice to have found this site. Where that sort of thinking is seems to be rare.
I find it amazing how twisted some people can make plain scripture.