Romans 8:28-30

dizerner

Re: Romans 8:28-30

Post by dizerner » Fri May 29, 2015 6:37 am

darinhouston wrote: If Paul is giving general teachings about what's normative for us, the past tense doesn't make much sense.
Paul does use the present tense both immediately before and after this, as well as sweepingly targeting all Christians. Perhaps it's expressing the completed work in Christ.

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Paidion
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Re: Romans 8:28-30

Post by Paidion » Fri May 29, 2015 6:20 pm

Well, I have been staying out of this discussion, just wanting to read the thoughts of others. But I think the time has come to express my own understanding of the passage. First, it is a mistake to take verse 28 in isolation, with the thought that all events work together for the good of those who love God and who have been called. That little word "for" at the beginning of verse 29, indicates that an explanation that I think makes more sense.

28 We know that God works together everything for good with those who love him, who are called according to his purpose.

It is not external events which God works together for good, but rather internal events. He works within our hearts and minds for good. He want to complete us in righteousness. Verses 29 and 30 give us the steps God takes in the process:

29 For those whom he foreknew he also pre-appointed to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the first-born among many brethren.

This isn't an inevitable process that God is going to make happen. God's knew people at birth in a way that no human being can know them. Did you know that the Jews from Jerusalem foreknew Paul? Paul indicated that he had spent his youth at Jerusalem and then stated concerning his fellow Jews from Jerusalem, "They foreknew me from the first, if they are willing to testify, that according to the strictest sect of our religion, I lived as a Pharisee (Acts 26:5). The Jews from Jerusalem knew Paul beforehand. That is precisely what "foreknew" means. And God knew people beforehand. He knew them from their birth of probably while they were yet fetuses. He knew what they were likely to become—what they would likely choose.

So He "pre-appointed them to be conformed to the image of his Son." This was God's desire for them, his plan for them. "So that the Son might be the firstborn of many brethren." Isn't Paul speaking of being born into the resurrection? Jesus was raised from the dead. He was born into the resurrection. Though there are others who will be raised, Jesus is the first; He has the pre-eminence.

However, one may have an appointment with the dentist, and yet not keep that appointment. So it is with God's pre-appointment. People can choose to go against that pre-appointment. But for those who do not resist, God calls.

30 And those whom he pre-appointed he also called;

What did He call them for? He called them to begin the process of being conformed to the Son. Yes, this is a process. What is the next step?

and those whom he called he also made righteous;

Some of you may protest that the word εκδικαιοσεν means "justified." And it does often mean "justified." And it often does mean "justified." But the word also means "made righteous" and I think that is the meaning here.

Now how can this be? Have any of you been made righteous? No? Would you agree that you are in the process of being righteous? I hope you agree to that. But the end of the process is future, when He who began a good work in you, will bring to completion in the day of Jesus Christ (Philp 1:6). We shall see in a moment, why the past tense is used.

And the final step:

and those whom he made righteous he also glorified.

Again, it is those who have been made righteous who will be glorified in that day. So how can Paul say that God HAS glorified them—past tense?

But one testified in a certain place, saying: "What is man that You are mindful of him, Or the son of man that You take care of him? You have made him a little lower than the angels; You have crowned him with glory and honor, And set him over the works of Your hands. You have put all things in subjection under his feet." For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him. (Heb 2:6-8)

When God intends to do a thing, it's as good as done. So we might as well say that it HAS been done!
Paidion

Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

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