What exactly does God reveal through his creation Rom. 1:20

[morbo3000]

I would appreciate anyone's input on Romans 1:20.

Traditionally, this verse is used to talk about God's natural revelation, which is not adequate for salvation.

But, it seems that Paul is not simply talking about creation revealing a first-cause.

It looks like he is saying that his righteousness, wrath, eternal power, and divinity are revealed in his creation.

Here is an outline I've cobbled together that tries to follow, and at times imply Paul's logic. I'm not married to it. Just trying to flesh it out.

Vs. 16
In the gospel of Christ is (=) the power of god to (>) salvation. (16)
That in this formula,
His righteousness is revealed. (17)
His wrath is revealed. (18)
Against all ungodliness.
Against the unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness.

What may be known of God (righteousness? wrath?) is manifest (revealed?) in them. For God has shown it to them. (19)

Since the creation of the world (20)
His invisible attributes (righteousness? wrath?), his eternal power, and divinity
are clearly seen (revealed?)
being understood
so they are without excuse.

[Paidion]

Try looking the verse up in other translations. Consider the following:

For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. (Rom 1:20).

So the invisible attributes of God mentioned here, refers to his eternal power and divine nature. These attributes are clearly revealed in the things which He has created.

[morbo3000]

There is a language usage pattern I noticed. In 17, the *righteousness* of God is revealed through the gospel of Christ. In 18, though, the *wrath* of God is revealed from heaven. Since heaven doesn't necessarily need to mean a dualistic "heaven," I wonder if gods wrath is one of the things that is revealed. Certainly his wrath is contained in his eternal power and divinity.


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[dizerner]

[user account removed]

[mattrose]

I once ran across this list. I'm not endorsing or rejecting it, just posting it

What can be known through God’s Creation?
1. The Creator exists (Psalm 19:1)
2. The Creator is eternal (Psalm 93:2)
3. The Creator is wise (Psalm 104:24)
4. The Creator is to be worshipped (Acts 14:15, 17:23)
5. The Creator is good (Acts 14:17)
6. The Creator is transcendent (Acts 17:24)
7. The Creator is self-sufficient (Acts 17:25)
8. The Creator is sovereign (Acts 17:26)
9. The Creator is immanent (Acts 17:26-27)
10. The Creator is righteous (Romans 1:32)
11. The Creator is the standard for goodness (Romans 2:15)
12. The Creator is going to judge evil (Romans 2:15-16)

[Homer]

As Matt posted in the list it might be concluded from nature that God is benevolent in sending the rain and a good harvest but from nature one could also come to the conclusion that God is wrathful what with earthquakes, hurricanes, tornados, etc. From nature alone, how could we determine whether God loves us? Many might conclude He does not love them.

[dwilkins]

The point of the passage from 1:16 to 2:11 is to show that the Jews had a unique revelation of God that gave them every advantage over the Gentiles, but they still ended up being sinners just like the Gentiles. And, God does not show favoritism.

A short example surrounding the verse in question is,

Rom 1:19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.
Rom 1:20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.
Rom 1:21 For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened.

When God gave the Israelites the building plans for the tabernacle he was showing them his attributes and the manner of function of the real temple in heaven. They abandoned that, along with his moral instruction (or expectation) given at the same time so that they became futile in their thinking and their hearts were darkened.

This passage isn't about general revelation. It's got nothing directly to do with looking at a scenic landscape or a field of stars and discovering through it that God exists.

Doug

[robbyyoung]

The point of the passage from 1:16 to 2:11 is to show that the Jews had a unique revelation of God that gave them every advantage over the Gentiles, but they still ended up being sinners just like the Gentiles. And, God does not show favoritism.

A short example surrounding the verse in question is,

Rom 1:19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.
Rom 1:20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.
Rom 1:21 For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened.

When God gave the Israelites the building plans for the tabernacle he was showing them his attributes and the manner of function of the real temple in heaven. They abandoned that, along with his moral instruction (or expectation) given at the same time so that they became futile in their thinking and their hearts were darkened.

This passage isn't about general revelation. It's got nothing directly to do with looking at a scenic landscape or a field of stars and discovering through it that God exists.

Doug

Hi Doug,

This was an excellent contextual breakdown regarding the OP.

God Bless.

[dizerner]

[user account removed]

[morbo3000]

As Matt posted in the list it might be concluded from nature that God is benevolent in sending the rain and a good harvest but from nature one could also come to the conclusion that God is wrathful what with earthquakes, hurricanes, tornados, etc. From nature alone, how could we determine whether God loves us? Many might conclude He does not love them.

That's what I am wondering, Homer.
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;" - Romans 1:18

I guess this is my ponder. Does our knee-jerk (mine too) dualistic definition of "heaven" keep us from seeing that it might be referring to the heavens?

The ancients saw God's interaction with us through wars, pestilence, and weather. "Heaven" can certainly be wrathful. And it would seem that it would be the most natural meaning to his hearers. Including Jews.

On the other hand, "Heaven" seems ambivalent about the ungodly. "It rains on the just and the un-just."

And I think "giving them over" is too many verses removed from the point. And again, it would not resonate with their understanding of the way the world works.

Just some ideas. The main thing I'm trying to flesh out is "the wrath of god revealed from heaven." What heaven may or may not mean. And why?

Thanks!