Hebrews 9...feedback?

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Steelwheels
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Hebrews 9...feedback?

Post by Steelwheels » Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:39 am

This was posted as an alternate interpretation of Hebrews 9:24-28

"24 For Christ has not entered into the holy of holies made with hands, which are copies of the real; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us: 25 nor yet that He should offer Himself frequently, as the high priest enters into the holy of holies every year with the blood of others; 26 for then He must frequently be suffering since the downfall of the world: but now once at the completion of the age He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself. 27 And as it is reserved for men to die once, but after this judgment: 28 so Christ also, being offered once to bear the sins of many; and to those who are looking for Him, He will be seen out of the second, apart from sin for deliverance."

Any thoughts?
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Paidion
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Re: Hebrews 9...feedback?

Post by Paidion » Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:50 pm

I don't see this as an interpretation, but as a translation. It is an attempt to be very literal, but in my opinion, there is one place where the translator chooses the more unlikely meaning.

The Greek word which means "a throwing down" is translated as "downfall". However, one also "throws down" a foundation. I think "foundation" is more likely to have been meant by the writer. The word occurs 11 times in the NT and nearly all are followed by "of the world." Having said that, it is possible that it meant "the overthrowing of the world system". But has that really happened yet? Perhaps a full preterist would declare that it has.

I wondered about the Greek word "οφθησεται" being translated as "will be seen" rather than "will appear", but I must concede that "will be seen" is correct since it is a future passive. If it were a future middle, one could translate it as "will apper". In the present and perfect tenses, the middle and passive forms are identical. But in the future tense they are distinct. This is clearly a future passive.
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Steelwheels
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Re: Hebrews 9...feedback?

Post by Steelwheels » Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:55 pm

Thank you for the input. You're dead on with the full preterist influence in this passage. This is from The Kingdom Bible which is a full preterist version.
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dwilkins
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Re: Hebrews 9...feedback?

Post by dwilkins » Sat Feb 22, 2014 12:01 am

Just for comparison here is the ESV, KJV, and YLT:

Heb 9:24 For Christ has entered, not into holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true things, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God on our behalf.
Heb 9:25 Nor was it to offer himself repeatedly, as the high priest enters the holy places every year with blood not his own,
Heb 9:26 for then he would have had to suffer repeatedly since the foundation of the world. But as it is, he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
Heb 9:27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,
Heb 9:28 so Christ, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time, not to deal with sin but to save those who are eagerly waiting for him.

Heb 9:24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:
Heb 9:25 Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others;
Heb 9:26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
Heb 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

Heb 9:24 for not into holy places made with hands did the Christ enter--figures of the true--but into the heaven itself, now to be manifested in the presence of God for us;
Heb 9:25 nor that he may many times offer himself, even as the chief priest doth enter into the holy places every year with blood of others;
Heb 9:26 since it had behoved him many times to suffer from the foundation of the world, but now once, at the full end of the ages, for putting away of sin through his sacrifice, he hath been manifested;
Heb 9:27 and as it is laid up to men once to die, and after this--judgment,
Heb 9:28 so also the Christ, once having been offered to bear the sins of many, a second time, apart from a sin-offering, shall appear, to those waiting for him--to salvation!

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