Paidion wrote:That's exactly as I see it, Darin. I don't think it means much to ask, "Would you still believe in God (or serve God) if he turned out have the nature Muslims or Calvinists ascribe to Him? For since God doesn't have the character that either of those ascribe to Him, why speculate as to the unreality of it.
I don't think it's fair to equate Muslim belief with Calvinist belief. While Muslims reject Jesus as the Christ, the Redeemer, the Living King, Calvinists (at least my friends who are Calvinists) proclaim all this and also believe God is love. They just happen to emphasize God's sovereignty over man's free will. I am convinced that they are the Lord's, but perhaps you disagree. Perhaps you believe that they are so wrong in what they emphasize and so mischaracterize God's love so as to be outside the household of faith along with Muslims. If I understand your theology, Paidion, in the resurrection, they will be sent to hell for 'loving correction' for days, years, or ages...kind of like that loving natural father that "locked you in your room for days at a time."
Suppose your natural father loved you and raised you to be kind and loving, and he taught you how to be a disciple of Christ. As a youth, would you still have loved him and coöperated with him if he had began to beat you severely, and locked you in your room for days at a time? What difference does it make would you would have done under those circumstances since those actions were completely contrary to your father's nature. Thus the question is meaningless.
But what if your father was beating you severely on the back because, unbeknownst to you, your jacket had caught a spark and was now on fire? What if you were locked in your room to protect you from evil doers who sought to do you harm? I realize that now I'm drifting into the problem of evil and why God allows difficulties in our lives and that isn't exactly what we're discussing.
I think everyone in this discussion agrees that God loves us and that God loves us perfectly. I think that our responses are just nuanced differently. Some people seem to be sure that since God loves us, He would not do (nor perhaps allow?) W, Y, or Z. I am sure that God loves us, so that if He does, or allows, X, Y, or Z, it is in light of - and because of - His love, even though I don't understand.
Asking absurd questions like, "What if Satan is God and God is Satan?" or "What if he tears us limb from limb like a devious child?" make no sense. If Calvinism makes no more sense than this to you, then so be it. Again, I think it's unfair to Calvinists. I have met many Calvinists (and listened to several more who preach) who love Jesus, study the word and seek the Lord for guidance. To imagine that they are ignorant about the bible, or to imagine that they are being arrogant or purposefully deceptive is naive, I think. I happen to disagree with them, but I can't dismiss the fruit of the spirit in their lives or bring myself to say that they serve a different, monstrous God.
However, for those who see it as meaningful, let me ask you this speculative question, "Would you still love and serve Him, if you discovered some day that Satan is the real God? Perhaps you see now why I consider the question meaningless and irrelevant.
Okay, I still don't get what you're going to do. If God reveals himself after the resurrection to be something totally different than you expected, will you dismiss yourself to hell for your correction?
