What is the right response if your wife is being assaulted?

[dwight92070]

Any thoughts?

[steve]

In my opinion, in almost every imaginable case, a man should physically defend his wife—as well as any other helpless victim of criminal assault—if he is able to do so. There are obviously times when one is helpless due to being overwhelmingly outnumbered by assailants, but a man obviously should be willing to put himself in harm's way, and even lay down his life, in the defense of innocent victims.

[dwight92070]

We have a BINGO here!!!

[jaydam]

We have a BINGO here!!!

Because you are looking for the thought that agrees with your already chosen beliefs?

I'm getting tired of questions supposedly looking for "thoughts" or "open to ideas" which are really bait by an OP already holding his belief firmly and no true desire to dialogue and be open to input.

Why not just declare your position and say, "How many agree with me?" Then pat each other on the back when you agree? It would be a more honest post.

My input might not be as well practiced as many here who have years more experience, but I enjoy the opportunity to dialogue and gain that practice and also hone my understandings and position. However, it seems like there is an overabundance of baiting posts lately where there truly is no desire to contemplate the sides, just a desire to hear an agreeing opinion on a already decided position and declare all others null and void - all camouflaged in the cover of a seeking question.

/rant

Take it as you will.

[dwight92070]

Excuse me, Mr. more honest than anyone else, if I didn't have a desire for true dialogue, I wouldn't even be on this forum and I have already dialogued plenty with you and will continue to. It was a sincere question, not a bait. I really wanted to know, and you, Jaydam, were honest and yes courageous enough to give everyone a straight answer and I appreciate that, even though I disagree with it. It appears that I can't get Paidon to do that. And yes, I do have my mind made up on this and many issues and i daresay that you do to. And no, I am not so close-minded that I would never change my mind, if I saw the validity of your position, or anyone else's.
I feel sorry for your wife, who because of your, I believe, naive belief, that you should love and show hospitality to some guy who just raped, or is in the process of raping her and then attempting to kill her, can never really feel secure. Don't you get it? Your wife lives in fear, because you are not willing to stop her assailant, even if it means killing him?
But yes, I will change my mind, even on this, if you can show me Biblically where I am mistaken. On the other hand, I have heard your opinions several times on other posts, yes, even on this topic, or at least a closely related issue. but up to now, I cannot agree with you. After a certain point, dialogue becomes useless, if our goal is solely to change the other person's mind, and yet they are determined to not change their mind. However, dialogue can be useful, to see other's viewpoints.

[jaydam]

Excuse me, Mr. more honest than anyone else, if I didn't have a desire for true dialogue, I wouldn't even be on this forum and I have already dialogued plenty with you and will continue to. It was a sincere question, not a bait. I really wanted to know, and you, Jaydam, were honest and yes courageous enough to give everyone a straight answer and I appreciate that, even though I disagree with it. It appears that I can't get Paidon to do that. And yes, I do have my mind made up on this and many issues and i daresay that you do to. And no, I am not so close-minded that I would never change my mind, if I saw the validity of your position, or anyone else's.
I feel sorry for your wife, who because of your, I believe, naive belief, that you should love and show hospitality to some guy who just raped, or is in the process of raping her and then attempting to kill her, can never really feel secure. Don't you get it? Your wife lives in fear, because you are not willing to stop her assailant, even if it means killing him?
But yes, I will change my mind, even on this, if you can show me Biblically where I am mistaken. On the other hand, I have heard your opinions several times on other posts, yes, even on this topic, or at least a closely related issue. but up to now, I cannot agree with you. After a certain point, dialogue becomes useless, if our goal is solely to change the other person's mind, and yet they are determined to not change their mind. However, dialogue can be useful, to see other's viewpoints.

I apologize for how I came across. I will not make excuses. I'll simply say that your response to Steve appeared like what I've been seeing, not only in forums, but even in my seminary classes. The "right" opinion already being predetermined as the initiator of the discussion is simply just eagerly awaiting to see how many get it "right" by voicing their opinion. I missed the genuineness of your question in what I read from the appearance.

You call my belief naive. To be naive is to lack understanding of the world. I understand the world completely. I also understand the power of God. Perhaps if we trusted more in his power and less in our ability to prepare for the world, God would show himself in greater power. I've read stories of Christians prepared for execution and the primer fails on the bullet, or the attackers are literally bowled over by some force, etc. Personally, I have seen a 29 year old man who was threatening my family and his wife whom we were harboring fall over dead after we prayed for it, and the coroner ruled it an unknown cause of death. I am not naive, I trust the power of God.

As for my wife, if she finds security in my ability to wake up, become coherent, grab my gun and defend her against an ambush attack, then her security is in the wrong thing. I might be successful now in such an attempt, but her security would naturally diminish as I aged anyway - got slower, less accurate, etc. By the time I'm 80, if I'm her security, then I'd feel sorry for her anyway.

I've been in enough armed and unarmed altercations to know that it often boils down to a crapshoot anyway - a lucky shot can always be a moment away no matter someone's skill level. My trust is not in being able to win physically whether with or without deadly force.

You say my wife can never really feel secure. Certainly she can, it just should not be found in me. Maybe I'm not home to help, maybe I'm too slow on the draw, maybe the other guy gets a lucky round off. Her security must be in something other than me if she is to have true security.

I used to find my security in my skill with weapons. I had a concealed carry permit so I could "feel" more secure in the unlikely event I should need to pull my gun. But I would say that those who find security in their gun and their ability to use it are committing idolatry.

Guns and ability can always let you down, and are the wrong thing to find security in. What if in a mass shooting you are the first one gunned down in the initial surprise? What if your gun jams? What if the attackers are wearing body armor? What if you simply are too slow on the draw? What if your gun kills a loved one it should have protected?

You can watch doomsday preppers and see where such placement of security in the material can lead you.

[morbo3000]

We have a BINGO here!!!

Because you are looking for the thought that agrees with your already chosen beliefs?

I'm getting tired of questions supposedly looking for "thoughts" or "open to ideas" which are really bait by an OP already holding his belief firmly and no true desire to dialogue and be open to input.

Why not just declare your position and say, "How many agree with me?" Then pat each other on the back when you agree? It would be a more honest post.

My input might not be as well practiced as many here who have years more experience, but I enjoy the opportunity to dialogue and gain that practice and also hone my understandings and position. However, it seems like there is an overabundance of baiting posts lately where there truly is no desire to contemplate the sides, just a desire to hear an agreeing opinion on a already decided position and declare all others null and void - all camouflaged in the cover of a seeking question.

/rant

I totally agree. And don't think you need to apologize. I think a respectful tone is a huge component to this. Dwight's wasn't.

[Paidion]

I can well understand the desire to defend ourselves from death or even harm. It is human nature. I have that desire as much as anyone else. However, I am glad the Lord Jesus didn't have that mindset. If He had, He would never willingly suffered the torment of death on a cross, and none of us would have been saved from the worst enemy—our sin.

[steve]

I can well understand the desire to defend ourselves from death or even harm.

Yes, but this was not raised in the question at this thread. The instinct to protect oneself is an entirely different (sometimes diametrically opposed) matter to that of defending another.

[Paidion]

Yes, but this was not raised in the question at this thread. The instinct to protect oneself is an entirely different (sometimes diametrically opposed) matter to that of defending another.

I know that a significant number of people (even non-Christians) have given their lives to save others. That fact seems to support your statement. Yet, there seems to be a certain element of self-service even in defending others. For example, why is an individual usually more adamant in defending his wife or children, than he is in defending other people's wives or children? If it not because his own wife and children are more important to HIM?